Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
08-11-2008 | 07:36 AM
#11
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Central Minnesota
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
So if I shoot a a.)400 gr(total arrow weight) vs b.)600 gr(total arrow weight), same razor sharp broadhead at say, 30 yds, except one bow is shooting this arrow a. at 320fps and b. at 250 fps, which one has more penetration and why?
08-11-2008 | 07:38 AM
#12
Joined: May 2008
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RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: PreacherTony
LOL! ..... it's been the same here ..... I feel like I'm in Florida ...torrential downpours .. thunder, lightning, and then .... sunshine .... then back to the rain ... it's nuts ...
ORIGINAL: bawanajim
Its raining here in North west PA's newest rain forest, the hell with deer season we're gonna be hunting monkeys and listening to parrets if it don't stop raining soon.[:-]
If it stops raining some time soon I might hit the lake at the end of the week, this low pressure fron is killing us.
ORIGINAL: PreacherTony
Actually, that makes sense to me .... maybe cuz I have been teaching it for years..... let' go fishin Jimbo 
ORIGINAL: bawanajim
Velocity squared X weight divided by 450395 will = kinetic energy.
That should add to the confusion.
Velocity squared X weight divided by 450395 will = kinetic energy.
That should add to the confusion.
If it stops raining some time soon I might hit the lake at the end of the week, this low pressure fron is killing us.
08-11-2008 | 09:00 AM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,695
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From: Texas
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: PreacherTony
Definitely not true ..... the sharper the head, the more it will penetrate heavy bone .... think of an axe...
ORIGINAL: TFOX
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
yep or another anology would be- try and drive a nail in backwards on a piece of wood.
08-11-2008 | 05:14 PM
#14
Giant Nontypical
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,634
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From: HENDERSON KY USA
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: PreacherTony
Definitely not true ..... the sharper the head, the more it will penetrate heavy bone .... think of an axe...
ORIGINAL: TFOX
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
I am not saying use a dull head but the bone is not going to slice apart like flesh or skin.A chisel point will do the majority of the work on a hard bone hit.Bone will most often shatter with momentum ime.That sharp head won't be sharp very long when in contacts bone.
08-11-2008 | 05:19 PM
#15
Joined: May 2008
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From:
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: zrexpilot
yep or another anology would be- try and drive a nail in backwards on a piece of wood.
ORIGINAL: PreacherTony
Definitely not true ..... the sharper the head, the more it will penetrate heavy bone .... think of an axe...
ORIGINAL: TFOX
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
The answer to 1 is on a heavy bone hit.
2 will be debated but the fact is friction decreases with speed but
resistance increases.
IMO,Heavy bone doesn't really care how sharp the head is.
yep or another anology would be- try and drive a nail in backwards on a piece of wood.
that last anology is incorrect, your dealing with pressure/in^2. Not sharpness.
08-11-2008 | 06:13 PM
#16
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,695
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From: Texas
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
Wrong, the sharper , the pointier the easier the penetration on bone, ply wood , skin, meat, whatever.
Its all pressure. With enough you can make something dull and flat penetrate steel. With a given velocity, or pressure or kinetic energy, whatever you want to call it, the pointier or sharper the easier the penetration.
I can cut through the ribs of a deer with a simple sharp knife, try it with a dull one.
Its all pressure. With enough you can make something dull and flat penetrate steel. With a given velocity, or pressure or kinetic energy, whatever you want to call it, the pointier or sharper the easier the penetration.
I can cut through the ribs of a deer with a simple sharp knife, try it with a dull one.
08-11-2008 | 06:17 PM
#17
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 2,434
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From:
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: zrexpilot
Wrong, the sharper , the pointier the easier the penetration on bone, ply wood , skin, meat, whatever.
Its all pressure. With enough you can make something dull and flat penetrate steel. With a given velocity, or pressure or kinetic energy, whatever you want to call it, the pointier or sharper the easier the penetration.
I can cut through the ribs of a deer with a simple sharp knife, try it with a dull one.
Wrong, the sharper , the pointier the easier the penetration on bone, ply wood , skin, meat, whatever.
Its all pressure. With enough you can make something dull and flat penetrate steel. With a given velocity, or pressure or kinetic energy, whatever you want to call it, the pointier or sharper the easier the penetration.
I can cut through the ribs of a deer with a simple sharp knife, try it with a dull one.
08-11-2008 | 06:24 PM
#18
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,552
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From: Normal, IL
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
Yes sharper will penetrate bone better, not so much because its going to slice the bone or even crack the bone. In order to get to the bone you must first go through skin, muscle, cartilage, all kinds of stuff. Thats where the razor sharpness of your broadhead comes into play for penetration on bone. If it can slice through all that stuff with reletive ease it will carry more momentum to break that bone and keep going. There are differant kinds of penetration, the slicing kind which you need to go through muscle and organs and then the breaking/crushing kind which is needed to go through bone. To penetrate bone you need a sharp point but most importantlyyou needjust pure force to break it and keep on going.
08-11-2008 | 06:36 PM
#19
Nontypical Buck
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,695
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From: Texas
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
ORIGINAL: passthru79
Yes sharper will penetrate bone better, not so much because its going to slice the bone or even crack the bone. In order to get to the bone you must first go through skin, muscle, cartilage, all kinds of stuff. Thats where the razor sharpness of your broadhead comes into play for penetration on bone. If it can slice through all that stuff with reletive ease it will carry more momentum to break that bone and keep going. There are differant kinds of penetration, the slicing kind which you need to go through muscle and organs and then the breaking/crushing kind which is needed to go through bone. To penetrate bone you need a sharp point but most importantlyyou needjust pure force to break it and keep on going.
Yes sharper will penetrate bone better, not so much because its going to slice the bone or even crack the bone. In order to get to the bone you must first go through skin, muscle, cartilage, all kinds of stuff. Thats where the razor sharpness of your broadhead comes into play for penetration on bone. If it can slice through all that stuff with reletive ease it will carry more momentum to break that bone and keep going. There are differant kinds of penetration, the slicing kind which you need to go through muscle and organs and then the breaking/crushing kind which is needed to go through bone. To penetrate bone you need a sharp point but most importantlyyou needjust pure force to break it and keep on going.
Bingo ! this is why fixed blades will always penetrate bone better than a mechanical.
Been there done that ! I will never use mech. again. I killed a bunch with mech. But given enough time you will see what I am talking about, mech. lose chingos energy on the rearward deployment, now contact bone. Blah they are out of steam.
08-11-2008 | 09:02 PM
#20
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 393
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From: USA
RE: Dumb Question/Momentum and Broadheads
Ever considered how much momentum would it take to get a passthrough on a broadside deer at 20 yards?
This is / is not a hypothetical question, since I have an estimate based on hunting results with my wife's equipment.
This is / is not a hypothetical question, since I have an estimate based on hunting results with my wife's equipment.