Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

In Minnesota, it is legal to bait bear. However, it is illegal to bait deer. If both were legal, I'd still bait bear but I would not bait deer.

What is you're take on this? What do you think of bear baiting? If both were legal in you're state, would you bait only bear, only deer, or both?

Why?

Do you believe baiting bear is unethical? Does anyone live in a state where baiting bear is legal, and do not partake in this precedure?

I believe baiting bear in Minnesota, where I live would be the ONLY way to kill a bear. My farm is surrounded by swamps, and they don't often leave them. To shoot a bear without bait would be near impossible. They do roll in corn fields oncein a GREAT while but this is usually at night, or out of season.

Just curious, really. I don't plan on changing my ways;):D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

IDK either way. Really what is the difference between salt licks, food plots and a feeder? What ever floats yer boat.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Bait bear with some nice corn or acorns

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Whats the difference? lol

They like candy, rolls, and bacon better anyway:DThe bears in my woods have a sweet tooth[8D]

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I agree, it is a double standard. Besides, wouldn't it be safer to bait a bear rather than trying to stalk a bear? Maybe that's just me, but I don't think so...

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Black bear don't really pose a threat, unless you get between a sow and cubs, so maybe.

The problem is, I'd give it a try, if it was possible in my woods.

Someday, I want to spot and stalk bears.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Man im moving to where there is some bears, sound like fun creatures to hunt, how do they taste tho?

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

One of my favorite meats, when cooked right.

You can't over-cook it.

It's a little greasy, but that is where the flavor is.

Caribou is the only meat that beats a bear burger on the grill IMO.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I might do it if I am packing Ebony and Ivory and have a friend along with me who is 6'5" 250 lbs has a suicidal death wish and carrying a loaded 12 guage. I can only imagin walking up the road or through the woods and suddenly come face to face with one. If you fit that description then I will go hunting with you! :D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Meh. Not quite. 5'10.5" 160lbs (soaking wet[&:]) LMAO.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

The fact that you refer to feeding bears or deer as baiting already establishes a negative mind set. As if "baiting" is somehow an unfair advantage. Bear and deer hunting is not a GAME it's part of the cycle of our predatory lives. If the wolf or coyote had the brains of a human to "bait" their prey, do you think they would?

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Kyle there was a few post's made in HOGHUNTINGUNLIMITED's thread that really caught my attention. I'm sure one was just a shot at me but the comments from the others really had me wondering how and why they come to there conclusions. Do most of the people that make these comments do any bear hunting? Do they think its just like baiting deer? For the most part I think most people are way uneducated when it comes to this bait thing with bear. In most of the states that baiting isn't allowed, its that way because the anti hunters pushed for it and got it, not the hunters! Spring bear seasons are disappearing as well, again the anti's are the pushers there once again.

Baiting deer isn't a must one bit in Mn to be successful in shooting a deer. Baiting bear however is damn near a must. When your hunting bear in the northern woods of Mn you can't hardly see 10 yards in front of your face. It would damn near be impossible to sit on a "game trail" (I've never seen just a bear trail in a big woods without ag crops around the area) and hope a bear walks down it. Yes you could sit on a oats field or corn field but how many of them are on Public land in northern Mn, not one that I know of. Its all big woods up there. Most of these agriculture fields are all on private land.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Baiting is what it is.

The fact you refer to baiting as feeding, makes it sound like it isn't there for a purpose other than nutrition. I put out a BAIT to KILL a bear. I lure the bear in.

It isn't an unfair advantage, but it sure puts the odds in you're corner. ;)

And yes, a wolf or coyote would bait their prey, I'm glad they don't.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I didn't[8D]

:D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I don't want to split hairs but yes you did!......... And later you contradicted yourself:D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Yeah, you're right.

But I believe:



My farm is surrounded by swamps, and they don't often leave them. To shoot a bear without bait would be near impossible. (here)

You got me with semantics. Damn. :D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Here in Maryland, you can bait deer, but not bears.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

we can bait bear in Maine but not deer. I have never tried but plan to in the future. Many good people in maine make their living guiding hunters for bear over bait. About two years ago their was a referendum on the ballot to outlaw baiting bear. Alot of money from out of state came in to help pass the law. The referendum failed, but by a very little margin. It wasn't until then did i realize how important this practice is and how many people provide for their families baiting bear.In MAine we have big woods and even baiting is no guarantee you are going to harvest a black bear.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

The answer to your question (is it a double standard) is not in what is legal or not in your state.....but how you view each. WHY wouldn't you bait deer? Answer that and you'll go a long way to answering your own question.

We can't baitbears in my state.....yet they're killed by hunters, every year (heaviest bear ever came from my state.....and we grow some WHOPPERS, here).

They can't bait them in VA....but a buddy of mine just sent me photos of the 2nd one he's had taxidermied in the last 3 seasons (both bowkills;)).

Its NOT "impossible". Will it make you have to HUNT for them, though? You have answer that one for yourself.

Answer the question in bold, underlined (above).....and you'll answer your own question.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

The one thing that gets old quick on this forum and any others for that matter is how MANY people will jump all over someone and condone them for their actions when they have never tried it themselves. Hunting high fence multi 1000 acre ranches, baiting bears, the list goes on and on. Ive only hunted bear in Quebec once, so i have very limited knowledge of it, but i will say that to shoot a bear up there without the use of bait would be a very very very unproductive method of hunting. IMO it would be a waste of time, sure its possible, but then again, so is winning the megamillions lotto.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

We have a short 3 day(?) bow season for bears and baiting is not allowed. I wonder every year how anyone even kills them. I dont see baiting any worse than putting on drives for them. And i'm not against putting on drives.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I am all for baiting bears. I think a lot comes down to the cultural dynamics of the state (as opposed to the actual biological aspect) as to whether it is legal. I am sure that states in which it is not legal, could structure the season/bag limits such that if baiting was implemented it would have no detrimental impact on the overall harvest. I do believe terrain plays a huge factor in success outside of baiting. Vast expanses of woods are going to make for much more difficult hunting. We cannot bait here in PA, but we kill a decent amount of bears, but 90% of that is done on drives. (yet another can of worms) I would love to see our archery bear season moved to the spring, allow baiting, and make it at least 3 weeks long. But I would have to take a LOT of drugs if I seriously thought that plan would actually ever be implemented. Our main bear season is only 3 days long, and the archery bear I believe is only 2 days long a week prior. AND none of these seasons are open on a weekend.

Now, as far as baiting deer….I have certainly opened my mind compared to just 5-10 years ago, and in certain situations, if it were legal I would bait them too. A couple places I hunt have large populations of deer, but not very much access to the huntable woods. Baiting can draw these deer from the safe havens (or just good habitat places) to those where access is better and may not have a natural draw to them. In the grand scheme of things for these areas, its all about killing the deer and giving the hunters all the tools they may feel are needed to effectively do so.
Outside of this realm I would choose not to bait, and honestly wouldn’t care to see it legalized, because there is ample opportunity to be successful without having to implore excessive tactics. And I feel it would/could vastly alter the natural patterns of the deer. I’ve already seen it happen with a non-hunter baiting the heck out of his land so hunters can’t shoot the deer.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

As far as baiting goes, I'm not a fan of it.I do however, understand that bears do not have the same movement patterns as deer have. They don't, for the most part,come out into fields or follow exact trails the way deer do.Bears in most regions live in VERYTHICK woods where you getting a reasonable shot would be difficult at best, so bringing them out to a bait is the only "realistic" way of getting a shot at one.
I'm no bear expert, butI'm fairly certain that they are almost exclusivly a nocturnalanimal, so baiting them gets them to come out/move around,during daylight so a shot at one is possible. So, I guess what I'm saying is baiting is the most realistic way to hunt them, plain and simple.
I know bear season is coming up for a lot of you guys, so good luck to all of you.If you do kill one, do not forget about the "man law", it's STRICTLY enforced!;):D

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Bear hunting in your state isn't the same as bear hunting in Mn. I'm guessing your chicken ass would be packing a side arm when walking through the big northern woods of Mn because its so thick and dark. Yes Jeff, It is that thick and swampy up in the sticks. It would be damn near impossible in Mn to hunt without bait and be succesful shooting bear. Why people can't understand this is beyond me.

You cannot use what one state has for restrictions and try and put that into every other state. Thats just "common sence" but then again I'm seeing more and more of that on this forum on people who don't know a damn thing on a certain subject but always seem to stick there nose in it and stir the pot.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Its a Common Sense thing, not a double standard.
Several things are taken into consideration when laws are made on bag limits and method of hunting ect.
The very first thing I would like to point out is a Bear is not a Deer, suresome will take it as an insult because they can tell them appart, but its quite obvious thats where their knowledge on the 2 ends.
I have never used Bait for a deer, no reason to, they are patternable, have a relatively small home range, high in numbers (compared to Bears)and for the most part are not nocturnal, however I am glad to have the option to bait Bears for the opposite reasons.

Without writing a book, estimated number of said annimal to be hunted per State, quota of annimal to be harvested and maintain healthy managable population per State, terrain per State, patternability of said annimal per State, ect...ect... ect!
Its a common sense thing!

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

The double standard, I think, Sliver.....is when you throw the word "hunt" in there. We (NC residents - where baiting deer IS legal) hear it all the time from people who oppose the practice. They feel like it takes the "hunt" out of hunting for the animals. I don't have an opinion, either way, I just don't employ the practice.

I think it would be interesting, though, to hear a man from VA (or any non-baiting state)and a man from WI (or any baiting state or province)discuss the difference in their respective methods of "hunting" bears.

From a state that does allow deer baiting....we hear the "it ain't huntin'" arguments all the time to describe the practice. I'm wondering what theNC bear hunter thinks about your bear hunting methods? Or...if HE thinks there's a "double standard".

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I know where I have hunted Black Bears (all over Canada)it would be next to impossible to hunt them with any success without bait, especially with a bow.

Not so of deer even in the same areas.;)

Dan

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

LMAO!! That's always been a problem of mine trying to find guys to share a Bear hunting trip with me. One thing keeps most guys from going.

The Big Yellow strip down their back. Many make excuses, and some have told me: "No way I'd hunt anything with a Bow that can Hunt me";)

As far as baiting goes? I think if it's legal in the state your hunting then go for it. It's usually frowned upon by those who have never hunted over any kind of bait. Especially if they say it is not hunting.

Those same guys will spend thousands of $$$$ on equipment, seed, minerals, and time to put in Food Plots, etc. and call it hunting? but would look down there nose at some fellow who hunted over a Bait in Wisconsin.

Double Standard? Whatever! It's not legal to Bait in IL. & NE. where I do 98% of my hunting, but I won't look down at anyone that uses a legal means at their disposal.

Dan

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

I've been hunting the Sandilands area in Manitoba for 10yrs now. I have never had a bear walk in front of me while in a stand w/out bait. Although the woods are littered with bears. Where I hunt its the only way to hunt bear.
Now with that being said I do know of some people that could have killed bears when they we attacking horses, donkeys, sheep and cattle....... But I'm sure they weren't going to shoot them with archery equipment;). And this only happens when its a BAD yr for berries in the late summer and fall. I guess they could wait at their garbage cans for a bear but that would be baiting too.
Sounds to me that in states where there is a 2-3 day season for bear and no baiting allowed........ they just have a season to say that they have a season. Of course your going to have big bears as the harvest rates are low and bears are allowed to grow b/c of it. I can tell you we have BIG bears here too and we are allowed to bait. We have big bears b/c there allot of them.
Baiting bears is half the fun of the bear hunt. Mind you its allot of work but FUN. When your bait is finally hit you know it! And then you get to figure out if there is one big enuf to kill.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Good Post!! I always enjoyed helping with the Baiting Duties when I have Bear Hunted.

I hope some day I get to spend an entire season doing my own baiting.

That definitely would be an expense and a lot of hard work, but I would Look forward to the opportunity.

Dan

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Our Western season runs from Oct. 13th to Nov. 22......and then from Dec. 15 - Jan 1. That's far from a 3-day season....or a season just to say we have one.

Makes sense;)

I suppose (don't know) that is where our bear hunters might question a "double standard". I can tell you for a fact that we allow deer baiting in NC .....because we have a lot of them.....and it's "viewed" as A way to help people kill more of them. If we didn't have the pops, though, I'm not sure it would be legal (why would it?).

Thats why your statement kinda puzzles me.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Well then let me put this another way for you since you missed the point.
No one in Mich cares what the bear hunter from NC or VA thinks sincethey dont know squat about what Mich needs as far as managing our bears.
As far asthem thinking baiting is not hunting,they aremore than welcome to come trytheir luck spot and stalk in Mi.
Just curious, does NC and VA allow dogs.
And what are the successful hunters % rate?

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Then why ask the question?

Can't speak for VA....but I know NC does in the East......certain times. I'm pretty sure ;)the season I cited above (western NC) doesn't.

I have no idea....and question why this is relevant (maybe you can help on this?) given the question posed. I'd hazard a guess it was lower than baited sites/states, though.;)

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Yep it sure is a common sense John but thats asking allot from some people. The terrain like you just stated is a huge factor in bear hunting. When I've been out west elk hunting in the mountains I've had multiple opportunities to shoot a bear doing the spot and stalk thing or just stumbling on them while cruising on a ridge. In each case though I didn't have a bear license which still ticks me off that I didn't buy one.[:@]

Spot and stalk is just about impossible in a thick big woods environment. It could easily be done in a corn or oats field but there's not to many of them around in certain areas. They also don't hit these fields until a certain stage in the growing of the corn and oats. After the oats and corn are fully matured bear usually won't touch them nearly as much if any at all.

If someone was to just sit on a trail in the woods and hope to see a bear coming down it, good luck to that fellar! You don't see just "bear trails" in the woods so one never knows what you'll see when sitting on a trail. As sandiland stated he could sit on a trail forever and never see a bear. He hunts in a region where the population is unbelievable. He's not BSing no one, its the damn truth.

Baiting deer isn't a necessity to kill one, you don't have to do it to be successful, thats common fricking sense! Baiting a bear is some parts of the world is a necessity and needs to be done to be successful or there would be bear problems everywhere.

Here's some stats on Minnesota's success rate on getting bear. All weapons are in this stat. Minnesota's bear population is approximately 30,000 bear. Edited the bear population in Mn. Brain fart!![8D]

1986- 37%
1987- 28%
1988- 30%
1989- 35%
1990- 36%
1991- 30%
1992- 40%
1993- 35%
1994- 26%
1995- 43%
1996- 16%
1997- 31%
1998- 28%
1999- 23%
2000- 23%
2001- 29%
2002- 14%
2003- 26%
2004- 26%
2005- 26%
2006- 26%
2007- 28%

GMMAT, How many bear does your state have? 3,000 to 5,000? I'm guessing you can use dogs as well as long as it isn't in a sanctuary.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Wow, some people really need to stop posting and start reading. Threads like this, that can be very informative, turn into arguments. I'm kinda glad this will be my last day on here for the next week[&:]

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Sports starting up Rory?

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Oh, so we just pick the part of the sentence we want to use when the rest of it explaines why! Im sure everyone else understood.

Well why in the hell would theylet dogs run Bear in one part of the State and not the other. But then, Im sure it has somthing to do withthe explanation in my first post.

And it is relevant to the fact I explained in my first post that zipped over your head. Go back and read it.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

baseball starts back up the 9th, but until next wed. I'm going to be on vacation.

RE: Bear Baiting, a "Double Standard"?
 

Enjoy yourself kiddo!!:D