RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

Most everyone knows that Texas is 99% private and that it is expensive to find a place to hunt if you don't have your own property.

This is because of supply and demand. There is a greater demand (hunters) than there is a supply(available hunting acreage).

So lets hypothetically say that Texas went to a 50/50 mix of private/public land. The fact of the matter is that the supply (available hunting acreage) stayed the same but the average price per acre went down 50% because now half of it is free.

But your argument/question is that this phenomen would acutally cause prices on the private portion to increase from what is already deemed as inflated and over valued prices. Doesn't make any sense to me.

I am sure that an economist could give you the theoretical number of increased hunters (because of their new found interest) it would take to raise the price back to 100% of its original but it would seem to me that it would take a very very large number.

From a Texans's perspective, be glad that you have a choice to hunt public landas well as private if you are so inclined or able todo so.

RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

I think it’s a far more complex issue than an amount of public land. To me there is no such thing as too much public land.
We just have way too many people, and a deep hunting tradition that leads to a lot of hunters. They say numbers are dropping, but you’d be hard pressed to see that since available land is dropping MUCH, MUCH faster. So the hunter density is skyrocketing. HOWEVER, eventually I think something has to even out, half hearted people will give up and find other pursuits. Some will pool their resources and “take back” some areas of private land. I’d much rather have land that is off limits because it is a hunting club, instead of a residential plan or a mall.

Now to throw another “wrinkle” into it. Does the pressure/greed to get a deer and have a place to hunt lead to more poaching trespassing?

RE: What about Sundays????
 

What would happen you think when 3/4's of the gun hunters are no longer supporting your rights with their votes? Where does that put you/us in 10-20 years?

It's a dying sport already............pretty sad I'd say and if anything I'd like to see more participation to keep our ranks alive for generations.

Drive like I do andlike many others do. I drive 4 hours each way to my best spot and where I could actually afford to buy my own patch, and it's worth it to escape the pressure and have a place that is relatively untouched by anyone but me and whoever is with me. I lived in PA central/western PA for a long time and it doesn't take a lot of time to drive from your location to low cost land, etc. I know you are within 1.5 hours of land that is $1500 an acre or less.........pretty cheap for anywhere in the country and a LOT closer to you than what I'm driving.

RE: What about Sundays????
 

RJ - I'm not too worried about me. I will never have a problem finding good hunting ground. I've got the people skills to schmooze my way into just about any place that I want.But, even though I'vegot more places to hunt than I could possiblyexhaust in one season, I'm still always beating the bushes. No matter where you go around here, since the land parcels are on the small side, you're always contending with the neighbors and people who just hunt wherever they want.

I'm just looking at this from the bigger picture - through the average joe's glasses. My situation is fine. I'll get my deer.

Rybo - you're 100% correct - our huntable land mass is shrinking MUCH faster than our hunter numbers.

RJ - As for losing hunters and losing votes - I'm not concerned one bit. Deer season will never be closed in my lifetime, or my kids' lifetimes (barring a disease that decimates the herd). As long as there's a huntable population, and an economic market to support it (however small) - it will continue. Ifdeer season gets cancelled - there's alwayssome animal somewhere that somebody wants rid of.The pastis alwaysthe best indicator of the future.

RE: What about Sundays????
 

You know quick if Lawyers were not suing every Tom Dick and Harryaccess would be a easier also. I know lady down the street stop here in MI. I talk to her kids, it was not hunting, it was the threat of getting sued. I think law suits are playing a part as well. Where most did not care, now do, for fear of loosing there land.

What do you do again?;):D[8D]

Luckly an awesome hippocrit of a hunter leased itfor 2008;)

RE: What about Sundays????
 

Germ: Most states grant statutory immunity to landowners who allow free recreational activities (including hunting)to guests on their land. Do read. http://www.businessnorth.com/businesslaw.asp

So, when somebody says they're "afraid of a lawsuit" they're either ignorant of the current law, or just offering a post-hoc excuse, trying to tell you "no" without hurting your feelings. Really, they're just hording deer or they just don't want you there.

In all honesty, by leasing her land, the landowner probably OPENED herself up to liability - because what WAS a "recreational" activity in the past has turned into a "for-profit" enterprise.

RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

As for that specific question...it sure doesn't hurt. But I am all for more public land for everyone to have a greater opportunity to hunt.

RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

Does PA have this law? If so was there not a lawsuit in PA where a rifle hunter shot a lady?

Thx for the info, btw folks will still try and sue. Even with a law, and a land owner still has to fight them in court;)

RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

PA does have this law - and YES there was a case wherea district or common pleas court permitted recovery against the landowner. Case is currently docketed for appeal and will be promptly overturned. Word on the street is that the defense attorney never raised the statute as a defense, and the judge was also unaware - treated it as a garden-variety PI case. Oops. [:-]

Props to you for knowing that. I'm impressed.
__________________________________________________ _________________________________________
Here's the PA code, just for anyone who wants to print it out and keep it handy. Always helps to give a copy to the landowners.

68 P.S. § 477-3

Purdon's Pennsylvania Statutes and Consolidated Statutes
Title 68 P.S. Real and Personal Property

[/align]Uses of Property
Recreational Use of Land and Water

[/align]§ 477-3. Duty to keep premises safe; warning

"Except as specifically recognized or provided in section 6 of this act, an owner of land owes no duty of care to keep the premises safe for entry or use by others for recreational purposes, or to give any warning of a dangerous condition, use, structure, or activity on such premises to persons entering for such purposes."


[/align]Additional details in 68 P.S. § 477-4:

"Except as specifically recognized by or provided in section 6 of this act, an owner of land who either directly or indirectly invites or permits without charge any person to use such property for recreationalpurposes does not thereby:

(1) Extend any assurance that the premises are safe for any purpose.

(2) Confer upon such person the legal status of an invitee or licensee to whom a duty of care is owed.

(3) Assume responsibility for or incur liability for any injury to persons or property caused by an act of omission of such persons.

(4) Assume responsibility for or incur liability for any injury to persons or property, wherever such persons or property are located, caused while hunting as defined in 34 Pa.C.S. § 102 (relating to definitions)."

RE: Public Land - a curse or a blessing?
 

Indiana also has easy access public land combined with OTC tags, but what's killing it for us is big buck mania and the leasing it spawns. We're not as bad as Illinois yet, but I see us heading that way. The sport hunting groups are also pressing our DNR hard for antler restrictions, which they are fortunately declining unless the herd is brought under much better control. Greed is what will eventually do hunting in, not access.