RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

This is a great subject buckeye...thanks for posting it.

My take is similar to yours in that if you pressure the does early you stand a good chance of ruining your rut hunting. I will hunt bucks by trying to pattern them if I can, if I can't then I hunt areas I "feel" the bucks will most likely travel taking into consideration the terrain, foliage, water sources, pinch points, funnels, etc...

That being said I will always hunt where the does are during the rut, My belief is that while the bucks will break routine during this time, making pattering them even more difficult, the does will keep to status que (at least they do where I hut).

Because I do this, you will very rarely hear me talk about killingdoes until either after I have killed a buck or late in the season. The reasonfor this as mentioned above is I don't want to tip my hand to the does as to my presence. I'll spend many early days sitting in those stands watching and patterning the does to get a good idea of what they do. This way I'll stand a better chance of getting on a nice buck during the heat of the rut when they are unpredictable.

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

Please when you find some hunting land in MI with low pressure let me know:D Now my Ohio place I will not argue.

What some do not take into equation is guys like Gregh, Buckeyeworked very hard to hunt where they do. GMMAT does also. That is a part of hunting

I just got lucky, I guess. I had a father who was a complete loser, so my Mom re-married my Step dad with 285 Acres of Prime ground:D Now you could say I was lucky, but everything comes with a cost. You should have seen my college fund when I was 18, I had just enough to join the christmas club, 16.95 cents:eek: We also took care of my Step dad's father who had ALS, and my parents paid all the back taxes. We were also sued by family, for drugging my step dad father and having him give my parents the farm:eek:. In 92 when my uncle died he did not havea will, the farm all 400 acres was going to be split between 11 people. It was a mess, so things come at a price guys. I know you just see the surface, but we all pay for what we have, one way or another;)

I know a lot more have it way worst than I did, and I would not changed a thing. My step dad and I are best friends:)

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

Honest question.....

If you guys were in MY situation....and you still wanted to kill a buck, this year.....how would you go about it?

I think you have all the info you need to determine a strategy for me.

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

1. I don’t even belong anywhere close to this list of guys

And B,
I hardly hunt unpressured land. It’s good land (habitat wise) no doubt, but its HAMMERED and the buck doe ratio is horrible. They don’t need to travel very far at all to find a hot doe.
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RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

I meant NO DISRESPECT to any of the names quoted!!!! I would hope I was safe to say we all work hard in the way we hunt, and it all comes with a price!!!! I guess I was just trying to make a point in how the pressures affect deer on different land, as we all know!

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

The old bucks here, I hunt, do not live, or feed during the daylightanywhere or act anything like the does and young bucks, period. They onlymingle with the doe familygroups for rutting purposes.

So for about 10.5 months out of the year, they are living in solitary confinement and the like it that way.They tolerate very little. They've learned, yes "learned" to associate various stimuli with danger and to survivethey react accordingly.

We hunters imoreally don't give mature bucks the credit they are do. Humans are only part of the "pressure" equation here. Predators, bad a$$ killing machines like wolves and mountain lions condition the deer and elk to be on guard, 24/7. Oh yeah coyotes and bears pitch in too. 2 months of rifle season right through the deer rut for elk and deer get guys stomping around in the woods everywhere, not to mention two additional months of archery. Old bucks learn to avoid these obstacles.

I dont hunt doe family groups (bed tofeed routes)until the last week of Oct.. at the earliest. As a matter of fact I hang very closeto outskirts of a bucks core area up untilthe first week of Nov. I try to catch him exiting or entering the area that last week of Oct or first week of Nov..he by then is beginning to lay his ground work out for the rut, he still wont leave his bed much before dark....here anyway....

The problem here in early seasonis a buck has feed in all directions for miles and he has the sameamount of cover.Forestland hunting.So pattering a buck is very difficult. Even if you get him using a certain place for feeding he's bound to switch it up day to day... he has to or every predator in the woods would have him pegged. He'd be wolf bait....

Core areas are big.. 100, 200, 300, 400 acres.. even a section or more at times .. and thats just his core bedding area. His rutting area may encompass 10-15 miles. Doe familiesare spread out hereand too theycan move and feed in any direction at any time. NO centeralized food sources.

I hunt and may go days without seeing "a" deer. Sure I glass the same does in the bottoms and near ag crops or the same young bucks day after day after day..but the big boys get it figured out and use elevation and rugged terrain to keep a zone of space between them and any potential intruder. Its a chess game and more often than not, I get slightly detected and buck skirts me or waits me out till dark...

If you want to kill big mature bucks here, you have to think like they behave, not like the younger bucks or doe familys behave. Then you have to get in and out without them knowing or your wasting your time.

Everything GregH, Motown said, I agree with 100% and much more of what the many others said.. to much to list..

but the last thing I would do here is hunt the does except from after week 1 of Nov till Dec 1 ... also when I do switch to doe travel routes.. I have not spooked a one of them.. they are still doing thier normal thing..

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

Jeff,

I would find the thickest or biggest bedding area you can, or a travel corridor between several small pockets. Stay completely out of it (except maybe one super stealthy sneak thru) until the peak days of your chase/seek phase and plop your butt in there for as many all days sits as you can take.
OR find your best funnel.

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

Jeff,

This would go against what you have outlined that you want to do (kill does) but I would be very careful as to not tip off the does to my presence. I would study their movements and pattern them to an extent. I would definitely not kill any does, I would want them to feel as unpressured as can be.

After getting an idea of what the does are doing, I would then try to find the bucks and get a pattern on them using the keys I listed on my other post. I will sometimes (time permitting) set up stands in areas I know I will not hunt just to get a glimpse of a buck moving. I may be 100yds out of position but I can get a good look at a buck and see if he returns the next day(s).

You have trail cams so it should be easier, move them around till you can get some pics. I don't use them so I must rely on my eyesight and time scouting to locate them.

If all goes as planned I will know for sure what the does are doing and have a pretty good idea of at lease where the bucks are entering and leaving my area from, I then set up stands in key locations.

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

Thanks Germ,
It always irritates me when people state that I have it lucky, that the big bucks are so plentiful where I hunt. It wasn't always like that and still isn't in all but one of my hunting spots. When I first got real serious about bowhunting, deer were unheard of where I lived. My father and I used to rabbit hunt there all the time. To hunt for deer, we had to travel "up North". Eventually we started seeing deer tracks and about two years later we spotted our first deer. I began bowhunting them because it was close to home and I didn't have to wait until we could go up North. It took me a few years to get one where I lived, but in doing so, I had to learn the hard way what they would or would not tolerate in order to get close enough for a shot. I wouldn't have it any other way.

Later in my hunting career, I took up serious archery. I rubbed elbows with some of the best in the nation and world. My personal best was a third place at the indoor nationals in mens freestyle. The one thing I learned...

You can be the best shot in the world but if you can't find a deer, you won't shoot one.

However, being a good shot does give you an important advantage...Confidence. I never think to myself "I hope I can shoot this deer". It's more like.... I'm shooting this deer! Very important.

What makes me so lucky at getting mature bucks is the Time that I spent learning about my quarry. Know your animal and its habits. Then you too can be lucky. This includes going out and finding better habitats to hunt.

Gospel

RE: OK... How about a little strategy talk....
 

rybo....John....

You both know I'm trying to thin the herd this year.....because that's what my wildlife bio said I needed to do. That being the case....and you STILL wanted a chance at a buck.....what would you do?

I've stated my approach....based on the hand I've been dealt.

If herd reduction was your goal....but you STILL wanted your BEST chance at a buck.....what would you do?

Thanks. I'm ALL ears.