jumping the string
 

"Jumping the string" used to be a big topic, in fact I think that ?Allen? gave it as the primary reason for developing the compound bow. Is this now a non-issue? Is a 200 fps bow fast enough that no deer can "jump the string?"

RE: jumping the string
 

a deer can deffinitaly jump the string at 200fps. i was at my archery dealer and he is shooting 318 fps and he had a deer that "jumped the string" at 25 yrds. although i believe he said that the deer was suspicious of something.

RE: jumping the string
 

deer don't literally "jump the string". an overly alert deer is simply reacting to the noise of your bow. however he/she would have the same reaction if the noise came from something other than a bow. so 200 fps 300 fps or whatever fps...doesn't matter, unless the arrow can reach the deer before your bow makes any noise from the shot, which is a physical impossibility.

RE: jumping the string
 

Tis alive and well. Todays bows are fast.... but they aren't that fast. A bad hit is as bad or maybe worse than a clean miss. I always take the animals state of nervousness into consideration when I take my sight picture.

RE: jumping the string
 

Have you guy's ever heard a bow shoot from a deer's point of view?Safely behind a object of course.All you can hear is the arrow not the bow(unlees you have a realy loud bow<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>)

SAVE A HUNTER EATA PETA

RE: jumping the string
 

Hawgz, what we as humans hear and what animals in this case whitetails here is vastly different. There hearing is &quot;more powerful&quot; for a lack of a better term, fine tuned to there surroundings.

We have done it with our stickbows, and yes in most instances you are right, at 15 yards though there is a noise audible. No also understand a lower pitch travels farther then a higher pitch. A higher pitch travels faster. Whats that mean, some bows still have a thud to them, just low to our ears. In the case of hearing it from behind a saftey wall, this thump may or may not be adible, but rest assured, they can hear it!

RE: jumping the string
 

I believe that jumping the string is a direct result of shooting under spined arrows that don't take all the energy that the bow creates. The energy still in the bow has to be released somewhere and that is through the bow in the form of noise or vibration. Anybody else believe this?

RE: jumping the string
 

Sound travels roughly three times faster than even the fastest setups.
It doesn't matter whether its the bow, the arrow, or spine of the arrow. If you shoot at an alert deer, he will most likely jump the string,resulting in either a clean miss or worse yet, poor shot placement, clear and simple.

RE: jumping the string
 

nope, it can happen to anyone, whether it be a proberly tuned bow with the right arrow or anyother bow. it has to do with if the deer is aware of your presenc, suspicious of somthing and just its overall reawction to the shot if detected. thats just my opinion.

Marc

RE: jumping the string
 

i agree with cods on this one

RE: jumping the string
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> I believe that jumping the string is a direct result of shooting under spined arrows that don't take all the energy that the bow creates. The energy still in the bow has to be released somewhere and that is through the bow in the form of noise or vibration. Anybody else believe this?<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

<font size=6>NO!<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle></font id=size6>

RE: jumping the string
 

LOL hawgz...well the speed of sound is 1100fps and since even a REALLY FAST bow only clocks in around 300fps dont you think it stands to reason that the SOUND will get to the deer 4 times faster than the ARROW?

I once saw a video where they studied string jumping...dont quote me on this becuz my memory aint what it used to be...I think it may have been in Primos' Truth series. Shooting 300fps at less than 18 yards even an alert deer has a hard time jumping the string. At distances of 18 yards or more deer have quick enuff reaction times to jump even the fastest bow.

** I almost got him but I refuse to take a marginal shot **

RE: jumping the string
 

Lilhunter you are totally right.knobby I wasnt saying that the arrow got there faster than the sound.I was just saying the deer is more likely to hear the arrow over the bow.To solve &quot;string jumping&quot; never shoot at alert animals.

SAVE A HUNTER EATA PETA

RE: jumping the string
 

Jumping the string, all this talk about noise! An alert deer or any other animal can and does see faster than it hears. I stands to reason that an animal that is alert will see something before it hears anything.

RE: jumping the string
 

so you think an alert deer will see an arrow coming at him at 300+fps before it hears it? i disagree... i've seen it happen before when the deer was alert and when the shot was fired it was broadside and never turned to the hunters direction and still the arrow zipped clean over his back. Again, just my opinion, i may be wrong.

RE: jumping the string
 

Hawgz was right on about listening to a shot from a downrange position. My hunting pal stood [safely] downrange as I was tuning my FX. Then again after I added Limbsavers and the Simms Modular Stabilizer. At 20 yards there is no human descernable sound from my bow; however there is a faint ppfttt from the arrow itself.

In my opinion it is as much the deer sensing something wrong and reaction to it. Here in Washington State in the mountains that ppfttt cannot be heard by us above the ambient sounds.

I literally and mentally force myself NOT TO MAKE EYE CONTACT with any animal I intend to shoot at and I think that this has helped me out to 30 yards. I also aim benind the shoulder and in the bottom 1/3 of the deers heart/lung area. Every deer from the Coues, mulie, whitetail, elk, moose, caribou will automatically Duck even if shot with a .270. If one aims at this lower 1/3 of the heart/lung cavity there is less likleyhood that your shot will miss.

Just my two sents worth.

Bowhunter

RE: jumping the string
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Jumping the string, all this talk about noise! An alert deer or any other animal can and does see faster than it hears. I stands to reason that an animal that is alert will see something before it hears anything. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

seldom seen....
where's your data to back up the above statement?

RE: jumping the string
 

first of all you cannot go downrange and stand behind sumthing as an accurate experiment. Whatever it is that youre standing behind is blocking the sound of the bow.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> At 20 yards there is no human descernable sound from my bow<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote> only if yer hard of hearing lol

theres not a bow made today that I and every critter in the woods cant hear when it goes off only 20 yards away.

I dont know what qualifies as ambient sound in Washington...maybe youre hunting next to a race track? :-P

Here in Ohio tho I will guarantee you that any deer within reasonable bow range will hear your bow go off under normal circumstances....excluding thunderstorms and/or high winds. Hearing it doesnt mean that they are for sure going to jump tho.

is quieter better? I think so

but theres not a bow made that cant be heard

** I almost got him but I refuse to take a marginal shot **

RE: jumping the string
 

Hi,

A deer will jump the string much more often when your using feathers on your arrows.A noisy bow is bad news,but if every thing is equal an arrow with feathers sounds like a bottle rocket heading your way.I know,Ive stood down range and heard arrows wizzing by.

RE: jumping the string
 

knobby not trying to say your wrong amd I'm right,but try it sometime.I my experience you hear the arrow coming canceling out the bow(to my human ear's of course)but with the newer and quiter bows that's all I can ear.All you have to do is stand safely down range and you can verfy this.Even stand with your head down not watching your partner,youll be surprised.But still a nervous deer or animal will react to it.Not so much jumping the string because it know's its being shoot at but as a natrual instinct.

SAVE A HUNTER EATA PETA

RE: jumping the string
 

dick_cress said it all, shoot the lower third and you will do well, string jump or not! I watched a show this past week where they covered every concievable ethical angle of shooting a deer and they drove in the point of shooting the lower third of the animal. This show was great, they explained every angle, where to aim, they still framed deer in real hunting videos, showed the thirds of the deer, the proper aim point and then the shot, when they didn't jup the string it was a heart/double lung everytime, and if they jumped the string it was a double lung every time. Great show.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Founder and President of
Virginia Disabled Outdoorsmen Club

RE: jumping the string
 

Tazman, I wish I had seen that show. It's sounds like a good one.

Certainly some bows are quieter than others and some faster than others. But they all have the potential to spook a game animal such that the animal will attempt to jump the string in many situations.

Dick_cress, I also shoot an FX and have had lots of remarks about how quiet it is. However, I have still had a couple deer attempt to jump. Fortunately I was close enough that they didn't have time to react severely.

The fast bows of today result in less opportunity for string jumping. Yes, sound travels at about 1100 fps, which is about 4X faster than arrows from today's typical compound. But there is certainly reaction time to consider. Take it to an extreme for demonstration purposes - suppose the deer is just 1 yard away. No matter how fast it can react, it's movement will be negligible by the time the arrow reaches it (whether it hears the sound or sees the movement).

Now, somewhere there is a grey zone where the deer will be able to react fast enough. Each shooter must determine what range that is and keep to shots that provide for maximum potential success.

As with many threads on topics similar to this, there are numerous opinions, and most of them are right. It's just that there seems to be numerous 'subtopics' in which people are supporting their own views. This is good!<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: jumping the string
 

Hello,

If any of you out there remember the early Wenzel bro's video's. The rule of thumb was-0-18 yards they don't duck the arrow.From 18-35 yards they duck the arrow consistantly,therefore if shooting at that range aim the lower third of the deer.After 35 yards they seem to not duck the arrow as redily.

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: jumping the string
 

well,i do know nothing about tjhis thread,it was a good learn tho.

AUSSIE AUSSIE AUSSIE OI OI OI

RE: jumping the string
 

I wonder what the percentage would be of hunters who said the deer jumped the string (when they actually shot over the back)? 70%?<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle>

>>>---Doug--->

RE: jumping the string
 

How many of you aim low then find the deer with the hole in his lungs? Reflex reaction is much faster than most of you give credit for. Think about your own reflexes. They are not measured in half seconds but milli-seconds.

As long as arrows fly slower than the speed of sound deer will have time to jump the string. Ever seen a deer jump a rifle shot? It is unheard of. (No pun intended <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>) In fact, my dad shot an elk with a 50 cal muzzle loader in the heart. That bull ran 150 yards without a heart all on reflex.

RE: jumping the string
 

I think string jumping has way more to do with the animal than the bow. If the animal is standing alert and looking/listening in your direction, he is probably going to drop the instant you touch the trigger. As some have said, you might still hit them, but the chances of a bad hit or miss are much greater.

I have hunted many times with little or no silencing equipment on my bow and if the animal is relaxed, they don't move before the arrow gets there.

I let the animal determine how I aim also. If a deer catches movement or hears me draw and goes on alert. I aim at the lower 1/3 and wait for the head bob to release. If deer is still relaxed when I reach full draw, I aim dead center.

RE: jumping the string
 

A deer I shot this year jumped the string at 22 yards(I walked it off) I thank goodeness was shooting the lower third of her, I did make one mistake though on this shot, she had both her front legs side by side, so when she ducked she not only went down, but back, the arrow hit the very end of her shoulder blade and deflected into her spine right over the tip of the shoulder blade. She dropped like a ton of lead bricks. Next shot like this I will(If I can)wait until she swings the near leg forward, or if they are side by side shoot an inch or 2 further back.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Proud father of a Devil Dog

RE: jumping the string
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I think string jumping has way more to do with the animal than the bow. If the animal is standing alert and looking/listening in your direction, he is probably going to drop the instant you touch the trigger. As some have said, you might still hit them, but the chances of a bad hit or miss are much greater.

I have hunted many times with little or no silencing equipment on my bow and if the animal is relaxed, they don't move before the arrow gets there.

I let the animal determine how I aim also. If a deer catches movement or hears me draw and goes on alert. I aim at the lower 1/3 and wait for the head bob to release. If deer is still relaxed when I reach full draw, I aim dead center.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

AMEN Stickemup!!! Exactly!
A deer definitely has the ability to jump the string, no matter how fast your bow is. Does that mean you will miss? Not neccesarily. Take all the factors into consideration, before taking your shot. Good judgement will usually lead to a good shot and clean kill. And yes, a quiet bow always helps lessen the chance of it happening.

RE: jumping the string
 

Jumping the string....OVERRATED!!! Do I believe a deer can react enough to make a difference of where the arrow hits if an arrow is flying at 300fps and the deer is within 20 yards? I guess. How much? Not much. My point would be that there is not a human alive that can say that the reason they missed or wounded a deer is because the deer &quot;jumped the string&quot;...UNLESS they had super slow-mo video of it as it occured and only AFTER they viewed it could they offer it as a conclusion. I hear the ole &quot;jumping the string&quot; excuse waaaayyyy too much. It's like every time a guy misses or wounds a deer he follows it up with, &quot;well, he jumped the string&quot;...how do you know that? I agree with BOWFANATIC that most wounds and misses are hunter error and NOT the &quot;jumping the string&quot; phenonmenon. I wounded a nice buck this year and I'll admit it was a bad shot and the flippin' buck didn't jump the string.

RE: jumping the string
 

i have never had it happen to me, but have seen it on videos. I have to agree with wolfen and bowfanic. It happens, but I dont think it happens as much as people claim it does.

If I may say... WAY TO GO to everyone on this board. I am relatively new to the board and I was getting nervous for a while. Every debate, and thread was getting ugly. Good to see its going the other way.

[Deleted]
 

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RE: jumping the string
 

Krisken are you hunting in the petting farm again?<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

For me the bottom line is this...I certainly believe that a deer can react faster than my arrow speed (and that's quite near 300fps), even at 15 yards. But if they DON'T KNOW YOUR THERE...they won't. Deer are used to hearing things in the woods...IE winds blowing branches to the ground, falling snow from a Pine tree on a sunny day. etc.The sound of my, properly dampened and silenced, bow will not raise an eyebrow unless they are already on alert.

Last year ( I'm not proud of this<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>) I had three does feeding within 15 yards. I had my 5 arrow quiver laying btw 2 branches just above my head and to the right.I aimed, drew and knocked the quiver to the ground and 2 spooked and ran 5-10 yards and the other just crouched and never moved. Had I taken the shot, the deer would have &quot;Jumped the sting&quot;...Guaranteed, but I didn't. I waited 20 minutes more and they came back to feed totally at ease. I'm certain they were laughing at themselves inside thinking..&quot; only a dead branch falling.&quot; Although I only had one arrow to make it count!<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Trushot }}------>

RE: jumping the string
 

Wolfen I agree that a lot of missed/bad shots are blamed on jumping the string when it is a bad shot. The doe I spined though did jump it, I was shooting a Bear Black Bear that is over 20 years old, I do not know how many FPS it shoots, but my new Browning Ambush is so much faster than my old bow that I had to get a real target for arrows and forget shooting haybale backstops. I would love to know how SLOW my old bow is, but I can not find anyone or any place with data on a bow that old.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Proud father of a Devil Dog

RE: jumping the string
 

I am sure you are correct in stating that &quot;jumping the string&quot; is an overused excuse. What the percentage is, who knows.
But &quot;jumping the string&quot; can and does happen, though I would say in most instances it is the hunter's fault such as shooting at an alert and tense deer. And the fact that the deer is alert is probably because the hunter drew at the wrong time, or has a noisy arrow rest, etc. and didn't wait for the animal to settle back down before releasing.

RE: jumping the string
 

Ok, Ill touch this topic with a 10ft pole....

Speed freaks say &quot;NO WAY&quot;...

and the rest of us know better....

~Will Hunt For Food~

RE: jumping the string
 

I have shot a lot of bucks, many of them looking in my direction after I mouth grunted them to stop. I have never witnessed or hit high because of a deer jumping the string to my knowledge.

I have seen it on video, and know they can, but it does not come into consideration when I hunt.

RE: jumping the string
 

A Deer is 20 yards/60 ft from the hunter. His arrow upon release will be traveling lets say 220 ft per second. Not super fast for a bow these days but somewhere in the middle range. Like it was said earlier sound travels at 1100 fps.
Upon release of the string the sound gets to the Deer in .0545+ sec. The arrow gets there in .25 sec. That gives the Deer .195 sec to drop down as they do allowing the arrow pass over it’s back then bolt or jump away. That is a fith of a second. It still happens but Im sure not as offen as it did when the average arrow speed was slower.
Now I don’t think the Deer knows to drop down to avoid the arrow. It is just a natural part of the reaction and physical process of the bolting away from danger.
How long does it take a line drive hard ball to travel from the end of the bat to the pitchers mount and have a pitcher get his glove up and catch it? I think Deer are faster that even a pro ball player. JMO



Work hard and be true to yourself.
http://www.hunting-pictures.com/memb...kas/index.html

RE: jumping the string
 

One thing that needs to be considered that has yet to be mentioned is the geographic location of the animal. This is a national website and the opinions are coming from all over the country.
IT IS MY OPINION that the deer from the southern regions of the country are more proned to react from noise by dropping their bodies in preparation for flight (jumping the string) than the deer from northern regions. I have no proof, but on most video's and tv shows I've watched- the deer doing any ducking are mostly from the south.
My thinking is body weight would have alot to do with agility.

MOST of the smaller/ wirier (110#=big) east Texas deer I've shot at have reacted to the shot. Some ducking the arrow some not.