RE: Why bait?
 

Can't bait here in MA, but in a state with a 6% success rate I might if I could. The best argument against it seems to be related to CWD in those area's that have the problem. Something about eating out of the samebait pile spreading the desease. To each his own if it's legal.
>>>>>>>>>>Whack!

RE: Why bait?
 

I bait on my private spots later in the year and hunt public area's for the big guys where baiting is illegal. You've got to really want it to get to some of these Godforsaken area's. (Can't bait on state land in DE). So does that mean that I'm unethical only half the time? Bait = doe population control method, in a state where crop damage permits are issued to registered farms from August to March. Baiting can also help new hunters; those not nearly expierenced as yourself;have more opportunities and interaction and develop the passion the rest of us have. Is a Thompson Center Omega with a Nikon Omega Scope with reticlesup to 250yds ethical? Do what you do and leave the rest of us alone - I've had to erase about 15 lines of text already and I've got to get out of the house on this crappy, rainy, windy, day -Maybe I'll go shoot my baited ducks today.

RE: Why bait?
 

Did some more research, and was messaged by another hunter from hunting.net.

I may have used bad choice of words but I will say now, that I don't think it's ethical to all hunters. It maybe right to do in certain situations with certain types of hunters, but all in all I don't agree with it. That's final. I know many may disagree but that's ok with me.

I hunt how I want to hunt, you hunt how you want to. I don't bait, I wouldn't if I could either.

RE: Why bait?
 

Stealth,

Thank You. Thats all anyone ever askes for is respect enough from others to say my personal choice is no. I understand your personal choice is yes. I do not agree, but I will not try to pass judgement on you. We can all get along fine , if we will just respect our differences.

My childern love to go out hunting with me. And huntingNEAR a corn feeder ( about 200 yards away ) is best for them. At least for a few more years. But that is when my responsibility to teach them kicks in. I can also see it for persons with disabilities. Real Disabilities, not the sham kind, where the man parks in the handicapped parking spot, then takes of running to get in the store, because it is raining.

Anyway, I appreciate you having the frotitude to come back to the post and state your thoughts,whilealso respecting us enough to understand if we disagree with some of what you believe.

Good luck and Good hunting,

God Bless.

RE: Why bait?
 

deer know where the food sources are and if a food source just pops up in the middle of the woods there like wtf is this and they know sumthing is up at least fron my experience but i all so collect all the acorns i can find and put them in a pile and i buy a bag of corn and dump it buy my stand just to make it seem more real the deer in my hunting woods drag corn all over the place from the field... i find it all the time

RE: Why bait?
 

I bait, always have, except the years it was banned here in WI. i just wanna make a few points... 1 the land i have access to hunt isnt farm country, its swamps and maple forests, not much for major feeding areas where i can consistantly see deer every morning and evening. 2 my dad and granddad grew up hunting the hard way, that is staying up til about 4 playin cards and talkin smart, then gettin up before light, makin a sandwich, and doin deer drives through the cedar swamps all day, but once my dad started baiting probably 15-20 years ago he has seen so many more deer and im sure he enjoys hunting alot more. 3 We dont bait intensively, we have actually been cutting back these last few years because the years we couldnt bait we saw alot more deer and alot more bucks, not becuase we patterned the deer better and put our stands in different spots, as most of our stands are permanent, but because the deer werent hitting out bait piles at night and sleeping all day. 4 this year we plan on keepin the limit toa coffee can of bait whether it be corn or apples per day. This should be enough to get the scent out and get the deer movin, but not so much food that they can fill up in 5 minutes at 3 AM then head back to their beds. The deer density in the area we hunt is pretty low, i dont know any numbers for sure, but since we got wolves, turkeys, and bears in the area also, the deer numbers have suffered. IMO there arent many things more disappointing than sitting in a stand all day seeing nothing bigger than a squirrel. Bait helps to get the deer moving in a place where we can get a glimpse of em, and sometimes a shot hopefully. I think i covered it all, I think every1 is entitled to their own opinions, but we gotta ban together and stay united for the ultimate cause, continuing the hunting tradition as we know it for our children, and their children.

RE: Why bait?
 

I guess it all depends on what you plan on teaching your kids.
If that's truly the only way you know how to set yourself up to see deer then I can see why you feel so strongly about it.

I prefer to take my son with me the entire year, to look for sheds in the winter, to scout in the summer, and what sign to look for in stand placement.
When the time comes for him to take his first deer it will be because we put in the time and effort for stand placement and not just in the right place at the right time when a deer "just happens to come by".

Are you really helping kids by just putting out bait so they can see deer?

RE: Why bait?
 

Schobs you worded that perfectly. Also where i hunt is all maples and them kind of tree's. We dont have many fields up here and if we do theres already people hunting in them. Lets all just get along and grow up and be friends.

RE: Why bait?
 

All I have to say is that up here in Wisconsin we are allowed to bait and we do it. Whenever someone brings up the subject about baiting it is always from a state where baiting is not allowed!!!!!! But anyway just for the record I have shot 4 deer (all deer were 2+ yrs.) already this yearover my bait piles and loved every minute of it. With my kids and job I dont have time to run out in the woods and find where every big buck takes a **** nor do I have farmland to hunt on that would enable me to sit on the edge of a field and wait for them to come out. I have to go in the middle of PUBLIC land which is about 20,000 acres. Now on this 20,000 acres I would like to see anyone of you with the same amount of time I have harvest a decent amount of deer without baiting. The size of the woods I hunt in makes it alot harder. It is big country and deer can and willgo anywhere. They have numerous trails and bedding areas that they use. Part of the reason for this is that they have to becauseare always getting kicked around by people. My point is that you can sit on a runway for days and not see a deer because they have many others that they use. I know there are big deer around because we get them during rifle season which by the way we do not bait them during rifle season we make drives. But during bowseason you do not see them because you find a good spot with acorns where they have been feeding there is another spot just like it over the next ridge. It is very difficult to pinpoint where they are going to be so for you people who sit on the edge of a field on a runway and wanna talk big because you dont hunt over bait try going into some bigger woods where there is no field where the deer are sure to come out, kill a big buck, and then you have a right to talk big until then shut the hell up about baiting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: Why bait?
 

My wife is smokin hot. She also had breast augmentation done in '04. I can't tell you the times I've heard men say......"I prefer real breasts"......only to find out that they've never had any experience with augmented. I can tell you from experience with both........I LIKE 'em ALL!

So...what's that got to do with "baiting"? EASY. I get SO sick and tired of people from states where it's ILLEGAL (READ: THEY HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE SUBJECT MATTER) passing judgement on me for baiting. You don't know my circumstances.....and you DEFINITELY don't know ME.

I bait on ONE parcel I have.......because it's 24 acres....and has VERY LIMITED natural food source(s). It's got some oaks....and 1 persimmon tree......but it is bolstered by 2 creeks and it's a natural corridor. If I didn't bait.......the deer would go somewhere else to nibble. Now......how much do I bait? My timed feeder dispenses for 7 seconds in the morning (about an hour after sunrise)......and dispenses for 10 seconds an hour before sunset. All in all.......I'd say about 3 lbs. a day. That'll sustain about.....oh...I don't know......TWO deer a day (assuming they ate nothing else)?? I don't hunt over the feeder......and next year it'll be replaced by a 1 acre food plot. You know what??? I'm gonna hang stands around the food plot.....and I'll bet you $1K that the food plot will draw in more deer to the SAME area. I can be a REAL hunter, then, huh???? THAT.....will be the decidig factor on my ability as a hunter. I'm glad I'll be recognized by you as such.

On second thought.....I could give a rat's axx what anyone else thinks about what I do legally while taking game in my state (ESPECIALLY if they're from another state). If you shoot a deer legally in your state.....by any legal method......I'll pat your back and help you track it and tak your photos!! KUDOS!! ALL we need is some in-fighting! You're a PETA wet-dream!

And Davidmil......with all due respect to you as a successful hunter.....you really don't know squat about why people around here bait. It's nothing like you imagine it to be. Neither of my '06 deer were taken anywhere near any "bait" (though I was near a stream and acorns on both occasions).

What "I" findsatisfying is people getting on the internet and preaching their drivel to others....in a condescending manner......only to findout they really don't know a damned thing about what they're talking about.

I'm satisfied of that fact, right now.

Jeff

RE: Why bait?
 

How about some pics! ;)

RE: Why bait?
 

Baiting is one of the most contriverial subjects in deer hunting... if you haven't noticed. In my opinion it is good for the deer and in some ways bad form them. It does help the spreed of TB and CWD, but the same as an ear of corn in a corn field. I think if spread properly (which is required by my state) it does tremendously reduce the slightest chance of spreading diseases.

I feel the main problem with baiting is that it causes deer to become lazy, and here in northern Michigan deer will rely on bait piles for food and at the end of deer season (Jan 1) they are basically left to die. Here in northern Michigan we get enough snow that deer have to make "yarding" areas which are areas that deer heavily populate to pack snow for the ease of travel. These areas are in swaps or very thickly wooded areas, for protection form the wind, and a place that has food source such as cedar. What baiting does is keep deer from forming these yarding areas, because they are relying on bait. They would normally be set in their yarding areas by early to late december, depending on snowfall, but due to a season that goes to Jan 1st it sets them back and in the dead of winter, causing countless deer to die.

Then there is the side that bait does help feed the deer, the difference from a food plot and bait is that the accessility of plots diminish as snow falls. So the deer react the same as a normal food source and retreat to yarding areas when it isn't availible, this on the other hand is not before it is too late to begin yarding. I see nothing wrong with baiting as long as you stop baiting at a certain point to allow deer to form their "yards", and to make sure and spread your pile so that disease doesn't spread.

From a hunting perspective and not a habitat perspective,I have just recently started hunting without bait and there is no feeling like placing a stand in a location that deer naturally walk,and you see deer regularly without baiting. It is also a toally different deer, they are much more laid back and less spooky. I also think that in pressured areas you have a much greater chance of shooting a large buck if you don't bait, here in Michigan they (bucks) have come to realize where there is a bait pile there is a hunter.

I am not saying that baiting is neither wrong or right, but that when used to the point that it is harmful to deer you as hunter should stop.

RE: Why bait?
 

Stealth, your hypocrisy in the original post has already been pointed out, so no need to rehash that, too much. :D


Not everyone has the time for that either, genius. This is my 27th season. I have baited 27 of those seasons. Because of my career and family choices I've made I do not have time to hunt deer year round, meaning patterning a buck. Does this make me less of a hunter? While I have the utmost respect for folks that hunt year round, I don't consider myself any less of a hunter. Why? It still takes a great deal of doing everything right to get to full draw over a mature whitetail at 15 yards. I have stands baited for venison and non-baited stands for horns. It only makes sense with the limited time I have available. I have all of 3 hours in the stand this year of actual hunting time with one deer in the freezer. No time due to life, but the bait allowed me to harvest a nice doe to feed my family.

How scary it is knowing there are hunters/sportsman out there running around loose with mindsets like that. Unfreakingbelievable. Any ideas why I might say something like that? Let me enlighten you: A ban of any kind on any type of hunting is nothing more than an infringement on our rights as sportsman, which can only lead to more banning. Where do you suppose more banning will then lead?

As for those that think baiting spreads disease, I have one question for you: Have you ever observed deer in a herd? They lick each other and have nose to nose contact with other deer without bait! Imagine that. Watch for yourself sometime, it'll shock you. Maybe we should ban the deer from touching each other. More sanctions, more banning!!!!!

Ok. I'm done with the great bait debate for this year. ;)

RE: Why bait?
 

I do not see how planting small food plots and then hunting over them is any different than baiting!

RE: Why bait?
 

Most useful information in this thread!!

Thanks I always wondered[8D]

RE: Why bait?
 

I had a buddy that I used to fish with. Just the two of us. Naturally we'd "keep score". As soon as I got a couple of fish ahead of him, he'd stop using the crankbaits, spinners, and rapalas and switch over to a worm and bobber. Suddenly he's kicking my butt hauling in fish left and right.

Fishing with a worm and a bobber is sort of like hunting over a bait pile. It's easier,fun,a good way to get kids involved, and effective.You can catch alot of little ones but not alot of big ones. Alot of us started out with a Snoopy pole, worm, and bobber. Similarly alot of us started out hunting over a bait pile when we were kids. But it's not as challenging or rewarding because it's a little easier. Is it still enjoyable? Absolutely. Is it unethical? No way.

RE: Why bait?
 

Genius, actually that's what I was thinkin'. Actually, being serious now, I don't know if you read my last post that said I can understand where baiting is used it certain situations.

quote"A ban of any kind on any type of hunting is nothing more than an infringement on our rights as sportsman, which can only lead to more banning. Where do you suppose more banning will then lead?"quote


I'm talking about baiting, not hunting in general. It's beenbanned incertain states why not all was my point.

Oh, just to let you know I have hunted in a state (For 3 years)where it was legal, but I don't currently. Just clarrifying that so people don't think I've never had the oppurtunity to do so.


And come on, you can't be done. Topics like this make the forum what it is! Well great, respectable points. Opinions are great aren't they, even if people don't agree. Good luck next time out in the woods.

RE: Why bait?
 

The thing is.....YOU show no respect. You only condescend and condemn.

I'll stand on my post.

jeff

RE: Why bait?
 

Every situation is different!

Personally, I've only deer hunted in TX. I've hunted in the west and I've hunted in the east. For those of you that don't know this. East& west TX are on 2 opposite ends of the continent. Terrain, cover, natural food & watersources are no where near the same. In the west you hear people say, "Watch out for those deeralong the road!" The place is infested with deer. In east TX you hear people say, "Let me know if you see any deer along the road. I saw one last month, they might be starting to move around!"

Why Bait????

Because, "in some places", it increases your chances off putting meat in the freezer. Especially when there are 30 hunters with 2 stand locationseach, crammed into 2000 acres of timber company land that is mostly 1-5 year old saplings. It's nearly impossible to see deer in this type of cover. IMO,baitused in this case to draw the deer out of the cover. In East TX, we don't have corn, alfalfa, soybean, whatever feilds that the deer visit everyday.

However, in some places,baiting can be abused. I've seen it, done it, and quickly realized thatI did not like it, and there are wrong ways to do it.

Sometimes I bait, sometimes I don't. My wife's stand and my son's stand have feeders within 100 yards. My 2 stand areasdo not have feeders this year.
BTW, I've "hunted" with my bow within 30 yards of a feeder for the last 3 years and I have not killed a deer in those 3 years. I only passed on 1 deer that was shootable and that was 3 years ago.

JMO,
TXMM

RE: Why bait?
 

Stealth you flip flop more than any fish I've ever landed.

Read this remark made by yourself one more time:

"No offense to anyone who feels strongly about baiting, but can you tell me why it's ok to bait, and why you still classify yourself as a hunter?"

You start out by stating no offense was intended by this post and in the same breath slam half the population of hunters in this country for baiting implying they are not hunting, and are not hunters.

"Anyone can pick up a bow/gun and shoot at something over bait. But not everyone can pattern the deer, set-up on them for a good shot oppurtunity in their natural environment, with natural food sources."

With your use of sarcasm and judgmental accusations right out of the gate, do you really expect me or anyone to believe that you actually meant hunters that don't pattern a buck but rather use bait do so simply because of lack of time rather than abilitiy, or laziness?



Right.


You missed my point completely. People like you scare the hell out of me when it comes to protecting my rights to hunt.


That wasn't your point at all. Are you kidding me?

You said this:
You were in no way questioning why baiting hasn't been banned in all states but rather stated in plain English that you desire baiting to be banned in all states. Huge difference. You are fooling no one. Continue your burble - you are only digging yourself in deeper.

Now go sit down and think for a while before you post more inaccuracies. Think long and hard about why we as hunters should not want more restrictions and regulations on our sport.

RE: Why bait?
 

I wish baiting was as easy as those who've never done it seem to think. It doesn't mean you will have deer automatically come in to be shot. Nor does it mean you can put no effort and be successful. You still have to be scent conscience, have the right spot with a stand and shooting lanes. It's no different than hunting natural food sources or any other place deer frequent. With the limited availability of hunting land nowadays, you may not have the natural resources or environment to work with. All you are doing is creating an additional source the deer have available. How well it works or doesn't will depend on how well you set it up and utilize it. As far as transmitting disease, baiting is legal in Texas and quite widely used by all hunters on the largest wt deer population in the world and there has been no positive tests since testing began in 2002. ITS LEGAL AND NOT UNETHICAL. Pretty simple. If its legal where you hunt, try it and post your pics of your 160 class brute that just walked in and gave you that easy shot from 10 yards.

RE: Why bait?
 

Jeff, please tell me how I show no respect. Not getting it.

And I stand by what I've said, whether, you or anyone else like it. It's freedom of speech.

I'm not go to be judgemental for what everyone's opinion is on this forum subject. Just because someone doesn't agree with me or thinks they know me and judge me, anyone that knows me, knows me as a pure sportsman with the most respect for the woods and other hunters. I'm guessing most the hunter's that posted on the subject are the same way, very respectable outdoors man.

But what is said, is said.I said and I'm done.Think want you want of me, post your opinions because that's your given right. Not taking thataway. Will not hold any grudges here over an argument in a forum.

RE: Why bait?
 

Because you tell anyone that hunts over bait that they are inferior hunters. You have NO IDEA of the extent of anyone on this site's hunting abilities OR ethics. You come across as a sarcastic kid that stuck his teenage foot in his mouth. (Oh yeah...and I mean NO disrespect by that.............isn't that how it works???)

I'll give you credit....if you stand by your words....I respect that. BUT.....don't mince your meaning. You know EXACTLY what you meant to say.....and the meaning was CRYSTAL.

Too late for that stance, now, don't ya think??????

I don't hold any grudges, either. I think you stuck your foot in your mouth.....you smoothed it over the best you knew/know how......and I'm done, too.

Jeff

RE: Why bait?
 

Because it's legal where I live and I can. I don't you or anyone else an explanation other than that. I could care les about what you think of me or any other hunter that hunts over bait.

And you're kidding yourself if you think that you will magically kill tons of deer if you bait. I've been on my current lease for 2 years and I just recenty killed my first deer on it. Deer aren't stupid and don't always come to bait like a bunch of zombies like some people believe.

If you choose not to bait, that's fine. But don't accuse me of being an inferior hunter because I choose to. You know nothing about me.

PETA sits back and looks at things like this and just laughs. The difference between them and us as hunters is that they stand on a united frontagainst ALL of us but we can't stop arguing amongst one another to do the same thing. Maybe they are smarter than we are.

RE: Why bait?
 

So , what do we do to other hunters when we find out they have taken a marginal shot, on a very small deer, with a crossbow, from a stand placed on a property line, facing someone else's land, in an area baited with corn, right at last light, and they didn't really look for the deer, and didn't tear up one of their tags?

Hang em' --- hang em' high,,,,,