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- - expandables (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/bowhunting/114383-expandables.html)

I don't want a debate or argument, I just want to know the negatives of expandables. i think their are some people out there who dont' like them, just wondering why that is.

I don't like them because I've seen them mess up many a time, and it's just another thing to worry about when it comes to bowhunting. I see, the less variables you take out of it, the better chances of success you have, including clean kills.

You don't have to worry about "whether your blades open" when you shoot fixed broadheads.

The biggest problem with mechanicals is the fact that anything thats mechanical has the potential to fail.

The biggest problem I personally see is people shooting them without adequate KE or Momentum.

My concern (aside from failure to open) is deflection when hitting bone. Any broadhead will do it's job on a perfect hit. But let's face it, not every shot is going to hit that perfect spot.

I hear alot of people bringing up mechanicals not opening. I just wonder how often it occurs or if it happens at all. In my opinion, I can't see how they wouldn't as long as all the blades come in contact with the target.

Not saying the Drury's are some kind of whitetail gods, but I was surprised to read in their book that they wouldn't use any head with a cutting diameter smaller than 1.5 in. They prefer the mechanicals. You have to admit, they must have alot of faith in them considering they hunt for a living, and shoot huge whitetails.

I prefer to shoot expandables because of the increased potential for accuracy under a variety of conditions and the increased cutting diameter on some models.

Having said that though, they are not for everyone because....

a) They require a certain amount of KE in order for them to function correctly...

b) Your bow still has to be tuned to get them to hit the target correctly and, again, function correctly...

c) Deflection on some models with longer blades during angled shots.

I have tried several brands and the Spitfires seem the best for me. One thing I have noticed with all of them is they are not ready straight out of the pack. I take them apart and adjust the tabs and blades and also oil them so they open just right. Same with after use. I don't know how they would react on heavy bone but then again I don't aim for heavy bone. I did have one slice a rib in two clean as a whistle.

I have used rockets for many years with excellent results.I have never had a head not open and I have never had an arrow kick on a quartering away shot.You do have to pay attention to your set up to make sure you have sufficient kinetic energy.

I don't use them, but I have. I like them though. You just have to get a quality one, like a rocket, or TekanII. There are some other good ones, and there are some bad ones.

more parts to go wrong..jackknife action..blades rotate backward on a pivot upon impact..that action takes energy away from penetration, overly flimsy blades and ferrules, questionable blade locking mechanisms..need I say more? Get a one-piecebroadhead and youll never ask your question again! You have to shoot 75-85 pound bow to overcomeexpandable pitfalls orcome close to a one-piece.....and it would have to be a heavy ass bow at that! BUT...as always its up to you .......so..why ask me~good penetration to ya

I don't use Rockets Steelheads. But I shot them through some plywood along with my Muzzys, and every time the Rockets got through about 7in. more than the Muzzys. So the penetration argumentI think is bs. Iagree, you need to use a quality head no matter what style you shoot. Give me the huge cutting diameter anyday.

I have never gotten into the mech debate before, but here goes:
I think the debate boils down to preference. I ditto what PABowhunter said about you still have to have a tuned bow and at least 55 lbs of KE. But there are some not so good designs of expandables. The newer designs have improved dramatically over the past couple of years. The ones with the larger cutting diameters require more KE so I would stay away from them unless you have over 65 LBS of KE.
If you have a tuned bow, have( I prefer at least @60 lbs of KE or more), and a cutting diameter of less than 1.5 inches, I don't see any problems. I use the Shockwave because the o-ring is behind the blades (less energy to open). It also has to muzzy type head to bust bone. I shoot about 63 lbs of KE and I have killed deer in AL, KY, GA, IL, and MN with mine. Still have yet to have any problem and passthroughson all exept one, it drove into theground before it could pass through.
If you use mechs, stay away from the big cuttingdiameters and make sure you have enough KE. I dont buy that the newer mechs dont work all of the time.The way most of them are designed, they have to work if you only get 2 inches of penetration because the blades have to open upon resistance, no way around it. A bad shot is a bad shot!, no matter what you shoot.

My advise: Shoot what you are comfortable with, If it is mechs, have the rightsetup and pick your spot. Maybe if we all concentrated more on shot placement, the debate over fixed vs. Mechs wouldn't be that big of a topic.

Quote:

I agree about the quality head argument but you cannot totally use the Steelheads as a perfect example of a typical expandable for a couple reasons. One, they have a shorter overall ferrule and a smaller cutting diameter than most other expandables. I think if you took a poll then you would see average cutting diameter to be about 1.5 inches. The Rockets only are 1 1/8. In the big schemf things that might not seem like much of a difference but when referring to penetration and KE it makes a huge difference.

Now, don't get me wrong, I shoot the Steelhead 100s for hunting. They are my "go to" head. In fact I will probably have one on the end of my arrow come this Saturday. However, I chose them for the very reasons you listed. Out of all the expandables I have tried they provide the best penetration and durability.

Ok, I love my spitfires. My brother in law had a spitfire not open last year. Before anyone gets started he is a bow tech so he knows if his setup is equipped right for them. It still killed the animal. When I have shot deer in the past with them the bloodtrail is rediculous. A monster hole is left in the deer.

I just killed an antelope w/ 125 grn Rockey mnt snypers, and lets just say they did the trick. I hit him right in the boiler room and the arrow exited w/ a complete pass threw, threw the shoulderblade. He only ran bout 35 yrds, which is how far i shot him. I shoot a 72# hoyt vtec, so im smackin them w/ alot of KE. I however carry both mechs and fixed. I use the fixed for second shots. After seeing the results of the antelope im hooked on these snypers, Ives seen antelope run for 1/4 mile after getting smacked in the kill zone w/ a 300 winchester mag, so they be tough animals. I like the snypers because they are one of the only "rear-ward" opening exandables on the market. This makes for a nasty entrance wound as the blades "cam" out past their locking point at first. While i admit this sucks up energy, w/ my setup i have room to spare. I also like them because they dont have a super large cutting dia.a large cutting diameter sucks up to much energy in my opinon. I shoot muzzy 125 for my fixed blades. They are about 1/2 as sharp as the mechs, which i think decreases the need for enegry as a shaper blade takes less energy to cut. In my block target i get about 2 inches more penetration w/ the mechs as i do w/ muzzys.

Downside of mechanicals.

the larger they are the more suface area they have the more resistance any target will offer them. this can become an isssue when shooting them at alonger distance. I really don't believe anyone when they say they don't open. I haven't had any not open.

the issue usually is people select a big one and they don't have enough Kinetic energy to make it operate and then they shoot it out at too large of a distance, make a bad hit out there and bigno there ya go another mechanical failure report.

others pick them up because they can't get a fixed tuned so they think that the mechanical will forgive them. Well if you can't get your bow at least paper tuned the mechanical cannot work up to it's potential. But they shoot them anyway. arrow fish tailing all the way to the target and of couse a lack of pentration and bingo another mechanical failure report.

For whitetail deer you don't need anything bigger than a 1 1/4 inch cut, you need the bow at least paper tuned. you should have at least 55 ft lbs of kinetic energy and you shouldn't look to shoot them past 30 yards with 55 ft lbs. if this critera doesn't fit into your style of hunting then you shouldn't be useing them.

What you can expect with a 55 ft lb rig and a 1 1/4 inch mechanical is: a pass through the ribs and heart at 14 yards. at 27 yards hit ribs and heart but no pass through. the heart offered enough resistance to stop the arrow at 27 yards. Deer went down quick enough but no pass through. So if you shoot out farther with 55 ft lbs and hit anything other that ribs and lungs you might not get a pass through. No pass throughs can make tracking more diffucult..

you should inspect your mechanical to insure that they are operating correctly, sometimes they will rust up on ya and if you don't check then you could have a not open horror story to tell.

most all of the failures with mechanicals are the fault of the hunters, they fail to do understand how big of one to use, they fail to tune thier equipment, they fail to inspect them to issure proper operation, and they fail at shot placement, probabaly due to buck fever. then they blame the broadhead.

I like to use them early in the bow season when my shots are usually limited to 20 yards or less and I have had great sucess with them, the blood trails areheavy and short but that is because of proper shot placement more than the type of broadhead.
As the foliage starts to fall and my shots open up I tend to use a fixed blade.

pspentration into targets. measure the suface area of any broadhead. the ones with the most surface area will feel the most friction when they slide into a target. the more friction felt the quicker the arrow will stop. A field tip arrow will out pentrate any other type of tip into any foam layered target. field tips have the least amount of surface area.