savage 10ml ???????????
 

I need your thoughts on the savage 10ml. A local store has one on clearance for $249.99. It is an older model; no accu trigger(sp?), or fiber optic sights. It is blue with black synthetic stock. What are your thoughts and opinions?

Thanks in advance.

Mike

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

buy it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I agree, buy it. I was in the market for an in-line and was considering the Savage. However, I ran up on a deal for a Ruger 77/50 that I just couldn't turn down for $225.00. The Ruger was black composite stock, stainless steel, had Ruger stainless rings and a 209 conversion kit included. Every Savage I've looked at has started at $375.00. One that is comparable to what I got is around $400.00. So I saved a lot of money but I can't shoot smokeless powder and who knows, we all may toting smokeless rifles by other companies in the future. Since in-lines, side lock sales have dropped the same way traditional bow sales dropped when the compound took off. But as long as we have the freedom of choice, then I'm happy.

If I had ran up on it or a similiar deal when I found my Ruger I would have gladly paid the difference to own it no matter the stock type or blued vs stainless.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I'd buy it!

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I would buy it you can adjust the older triggers.I have an older model with the old trigger and a false muzzle,and a newer model with the old trigger and both shoot about the same.
If all my rifles had the accru-trigger on them I would love them,The only one I have with the accru-trigger is a 223, and I have to get used to it every time I shoot the 223 so I prefer the older trigger.
Was it a ML1 or ML11?

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Herman,

The markings on the barrel stated 10ml.

This would be my first muzzleloader and since I am familiar with bolt actions, it kind of appealed to me. It seamed over built compared to the others on the rack. I guess that would account for it being able to withstand the higher pressures of smokeless powder. What kind of accuracy could be reasonably expected and what is the effective range, I have no idea? Anybody have experience with them?

Thanks,

Mike

Now I have to convince my better half that it is to good of a deal to pass up. SC already has a long season, which gets irritating to her by December. This would stretch the season a little bit more! ;)

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

If it's a 10ML-I (the original version), then it's a pretty good deal...but if it's a 10ML-II (pre Accu-Trigger) it's a steal. The 10ML-II adressed some convienience issues, like changing thje bolt and breachplug design to eliminate the 'ignition module,' which is simply a brass part that appears similar to a cartridge that's purpose is to hold the 209 primer. The 10ML-II has the primer slid into a slot directly on the boltface, which means there is nothing to lose. If you lose the ignition module for the 10ML in the field, you're out of luck.

Otherwise, the Savage is a great rifle. I have an Accu-Trigger equipped 10ML-IIBSS with the laminate stock and stainless barrelled action, and I absolutely love it. It's, by far, the best ML I've owned and I've owned several from several major brands (T/C, Knight and Traditions), and would buy another Savage in a heartbeat. I shoot 40.5 grains of Vhita Vouri N110 under a 300 grain Hornady SST/ML sabot at 2250fps, and get 1.5MOA out to 200 yards with it. It's clean, easy to maintain, reliable, and very convienient. It allows me to spend more time thinking about hunting, and a lot less time worrying about the rifle and whether it's going to go boom when I need it too.

Good luck,

Mike

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Mine has ML10-11 on the barrel so I think yours is the first one they came out with,it has a clylinder(cannot remember what they are called ) that you put the primer in and put it in the chamber,the ML11 the primer fits in the bolt face.
If you work with them (just like any other rifle) they are capable of shooting very tight groups.I have shot less than inch groups @200 yds and a few 3in groups @300 yds,and lots of 3-shot one hole groups @100 yds.Last year alone I put over a thousand rounds through the 2 I have.
They are a little heavy but the ease of cleaning and the way they shoot make up for it.You can get lots of info here.
[link]http://dougva.proboards34.com/index.cgi[/link]

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Sounds like a really good deal to me.
I am seening the 10ML's (not the 10MLII's) USED for that price.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I despise inlines, and I will never buy one.

They are a legalistic way of taking advantage of hunting seasons intended for traditional muzzleloading rifles. They are modern rifles, pure and simple, especially the Savage that uses "smokeless" powder, and do not teach the shooter either the shooting skills or hunting techniques that come with using tradtional muzzleloading rifles. The only advantage to having "inline" muzzleloading rifles available is that it gets more "shooters" into the woods to kill more deer when the deer population is growing every year. However, they should wait until the modern rifle season begins to use their modern, single shot rifles, because that is what they are. But then they wouldn't use the "inline," preferring an auto-loader, lever gun, or bolt action rifle instead.

Just my $0.02. Somebody needed to say it.

Kenneth Smith
Monroe, Louisiana

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Ok, reading between the lines here. What you really are saying is, dang it, I am mad, that there are more hunters in the woods in what used to be a low pressure season where me and my fellow traditionalist could have more woods to ourselves.

I understand your pain. I used to feel the way about traditionlist with ML as a serious bowhunter. Where the ML is a crutch that doesn't teach you the hunting skills to get close to your game and ML hunters should wait until the firearms season instead of scaring our realatively unspooked game. Where really some of ML seasons are impeding with our long and warm season of bowhunting.

But I just go with the flow, and break out a ML that week and hope you traditionlist making all that noise doesn't scare the crap out of the deer so we can get back to real hunting with a bow.

I bet someone is hold his knife or spear saying the same about us bowhunters. Sometimes you have to think a little outside the box my friend and remember with a gun, be it ML or centerfire, its very easy to kill game comparied to alot of hunting out there. And your idea of spirit definately isn't the same as everybodies.

And remember public woods is for everybody, you got to share em.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Oh, the debate goes on and on. Like I said in an earlier reply, "as long as I have freedom of choice". I am a traditonal bowhunter using either a recurve or longbow but I do own a compound and did not oppose them when they came out. A bow is a bow is a bow with one arrow going out. It is still up to the archer to hit where his arrow flies. When the primitive season for muzzleloaders started in Virginia, they had to be side locks, muzzleloading, and capable of firing one LEADED projectile. Then inlines came out and they got accepted but you still couldn't use scopes or anything but leaded projectiles. Then scopes got accepted as well as did the sabots and copper bullets. But, a muzzleloader is a muzzleloader is a muzzleloader with only one shot. No doubt an easier shot with scopes but still one shot for the shooter. The County I live in had allowed muzzleloaders for the early black powder season but only allowed shotguns for the general deer season. Last year, they enacted an game ordinance allowing muzzleloaders to be used during the general deer season as well. I bought my inline so I could scope it and use it during the general firearms season where I tend to have up to a hundred yard shots after the leaves have fallen. I have always personally felt the shotgun is a poor firearm for deer hunting and that more deer have been wounded and lost due to this weapon whether on its own merit or some nimrod trying to use it past its effective range. During the primitive season, I still use my old F.I.E. Kentucky, 1 in 68 twist, with my 133 grain patched roundballs. But again, that is my choice. I do not oppose my brother-in-law who will never use his sidelocks again and now will only use his Knight inline. Again, freedom of choice.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Just blowing off a little steam. And you are right, the woods are for everyone. But I think you misread the lines a bit, so I'll clarify my testy lines: We need more hunters, not fewer, and to that end inlines serve to get more involved. My contention is one easily ignored--these are clearly *modern* rifles whose only connection with the muzzleloading season is the fact that they load the bullet through the muzzle, and that is what the majority of the Game & Fish departments care about. Smokeless propellants, inline ignition systems, and high-powered scoped sights put these rifles into the modern category right there with bolt-action rifles. The inline is a modern rifle, and while the rifle's design might make it more appropriate for use in the *modern* or regular game season, we traditional muzzleloading hunters can welcome the company.;)

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I agree with ya caionneach. Thier performance is really getting some attention. Here in MD for instance, they don't care much about the one shot, but the flattness. And they are reaching the point that they can travel very far with alot of energy.

Will it cause them to end ML or limit it in some way? Jury is out. I hope they (DNR) just limit it some. I doubt the number of Savages in the woods will cause that.

My county for instance is one of the few in MD you can use a rifle. it will only take one instance of going thru someones house or whatever to change that to a shotgun county.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I catch some friendly flak from a more traditional ML'er every now and then when I am shooting an Inline.
Last time this happened, I put the Inline away in a case, went to the next case and pulled out a percussion sidelock and asked "can we now be friends"?
:)

Seriously though, there already was an idiot bill introduced here in Michigan to restrict inline ML hunting from the southern shotgun/BP zone to the rifle zone only.

I think as long as ML's effective performance range regardless of design stays where it's at then things legal-wise should remain mostly the same.

If effective ranges and designs venture out beyond 200 yards, then I would expect and largely appreciate some sort of regulation. The trend is more populous areas and longer range weaponry will become a liability in these areas.

My .02 on the off topic.
;)

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

I am speaking for my self,I have been hunting over 50 yrs and I have taken game not just deer with a recurve,compound,sidelock,inline and savage but didn't know they took different skills to kill deer.about the only difference I know is you have to get a little closer using different weapons.I took a 11 point buck one year with a T/C sidelock with open sights a lot farther than I ever will with a savage (lucky shot).
I think as long as its legal in the state you are hunting use anything you like.
If you're using a tree stand and lets say a flintlock,how traditional is that. I never saw a pic of Daniel Boone sitting in one.
If you have all that skill and techniques that you learned just using a sidelock you shouldn't have a problem taking a little old deer.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Your kidding right? With a compound or recurve up in a tree stand. You have perform 3 times the steps including being close. With a gun, you see a deer, you point and fire. And have the luck of firing well out of site of movement with the deer. With a bow, you usually have to stand up, then unless you hold your bow the whole time, grab your bow and take it off your holder/hook, whatever. Then you have to knock it or with a release, knock that on. And finally pull back and aim with this critter being right up on you. At least three times the movement and IMO 3 to 4 times more difficult. Not to mention how critical your form needs to be. You can shoot left handed half drunk with a gun and still knock something down with a ML or rifle.

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

Didn't say I shot any with a bow out of a tree stand.Out of 35 taken with a bow only 6 have been taken out of a tree stand the rest was on the ground sitting or standing next to a tree.Don't hunt much out of a tree stand before but this past year have had too because of heart attack and by-pass surgery cannot get around like I used too.
Have seen guys sober that couldn't hit a deer at 20 yds with a rifle too.
I don't guess my point came out like it should have,was meaning the skills besides shooting,like sign,where they bed,what they are eating etc.Don't think you need any kind of weapon to teach someone these.Do you think these type of skills are different with different types of weapons?

RE: savage 10ml ???????????
 

If inlines bring more new hunters into the woods, then it can only be a good thing for EVERYONE because it ensures that our sport will live on for future generations.

Take bowhunting as an example. Before the compound bow was introduced and gained acceptance, there were relatively few, but admittedly very dedicated, traditional bowhunters in the woods. Now, with the current pressure from anti-hunting groups to ban bowhunting as unethical and cruel, do anyone honestly think that this tiny portion of the hunting community, without the huge ranks of compound-only bowhunters that exist today, would have been able to preserve their season? The honest answer is NO. If the states, at the behest of the bigoted traditionalists trying to hoard the season for their exclusive use, had outright banned the use of "modern, high-performance," compound bows, and these compound bows had waxed into obscurity, bowhunting would not exist today because their season would have been yanked right out from under them by the anti's looking to route any hunting season they think they can get away with.

We're going this same route with the anti-inline protectionists. They want "their" season returned for their exclusive use, and instead of seeing inline shooters as fellow hunters and preservers of the ML hunting heritage in a slightly updated form, they instead look down their noses at them, poo-poo their choice of weapon, and think of them unskilled bumbling slobs because they use a gun that shoots a little faster or handles a little better than their big-bore Brown Bess flinter. When the reality of it is that an inline, while "modern" in appearance (as, say, an K98 Mauser is also 'modern'), it still loads from the front one shot at a time and provides the hunter, unless very lucky, with one and ONLY one shot, whether the range is 20 or 200 yards.

So I will say that I am THANKFUL, as we all should be, that Tony Knight reignited the passion for muzzleloading among the masses with the reintroduction of the inline ML, not just because I enjoy and prefer the inline design, but also because I know that because of the inline, my daughter (if she so chooses) will be able to take her choice of a traditional Hawken flintlock, or "modern" inline into the woods when she's old enough and hunt deer despite the anti's best efforts at preventing her from having the right to do so.

Mike

10ml 1
 

problems with the modules sealing or wearing out from loading and unloading to transport i have module with less than ten shoots that are leaking savage will not stand behind updating the gun and many of the modules are mis machined from the get go gun has less than fifty im down to my last 3 modules out of a dozen i ordered when i got the gun any one have any input

WOW, talk about digging up a old thread. :happy0157::happy0157:

Savage quit using modules long ago. There are conversions to allow them to use shortened CF cases with a new breach plug. If you don't like it, put it up for sale on Doug's Savage and smokeless forum. Someone will buy it.

The MLII models use a bare 209 primer.

I guess the new years theme is for newbies to resurrect random old threads of as a way to make your first post on the forum. Happening alot lately. This one is only 8 yrs old... wow.

:confused0024:

It makes we wonder if he knows about replacing the vent liner. When the vent erodes it increases pressure on the primer a lot. The old design had 3 holes and they wore out FAST. I don't think you can get those vent liners any more and the plug sounds like it trashed now. It will keep eating modules unless the breach plug can be resurfaced.

I definitely like your .02 cents pal. :cool2:

yep me too :happy0001:

Myself, i don't understand why my path is not respected. What i did was move to a new state, and read the game regulations. What became apparent to me was if i took up the muzzle loader, i could purchase 5 doe tags, and go hunting, if my rifle met the regulation. That is when i purchased my first muzzle loader, an X7, because the regulation required iron sights, and non-smokeless powder, and bullets larger than 44 caliber. Well, the first year i owned the rifle, i didn't satisfy resident requirements, so i just shot paper. Having to use iron sights was a huge issue, because my old eyes couldn't focus on the front sight. To facilitate developing a good load, i mounted a scope and learned and learned about muzzle loader shooting from a modern in-line.

When the next muzzy season rolled around, i removed the optic, and hunted with the iron sights. It seemed so wrong to me, to have to hunt with a sight i couldn't really 'see', but i did it. Because i enjoyed hunting and shooting my inline muzzle loader so much, the next year i mounted a scope and hunted the regular rifle season with the muzzle loader. This i have done every year since, mostly because i enjoy hunting when i can see the sights. This year, for the first time, i was able to use a 1X scope during the muzzy season instead of the iron sights. What a wonderful experience that was for me. Being able to hunt deer using sights i could actually see. Sighting through a 1X scope is kinda like sighting through a straw, and isn't the best. Using a 1X scope with all the drawbacks, is so very very much more better than iron sights, i now no longer will hunt our regular rifle season with a muzzle loader. Being able to use the 1X scope for hunting the muzzy season, has allowed me to enjoy hunting the muzzy season for the first time, without worry of crippling deer, because i can't see the front sight.

The only reason i took up the muzzle loader, was to extend my hunting season. Regulation allowed me to use an inline. This year for the first time, regulation allowed a 1X scope. To me, these regulation have made my enjoyment of hunting more positive, and allowed me to make my kills with less chance of a 'gut shot'. Now that i can see the sights on my muzzle loader, i will enjoy muzzy season more than ever, and will no longer have to use a muzzle loader during the regular rifle season. The future will find me shooting, and researching a breech loader, which i will use from now forward, hunting the regular rifle season.

Give Joe Degrande a call and see what he can do for ya. I think you'll be really happy after you do that.

Somebody who says that and then puts a modern scope on their sidelock like I've seen in pics sounds more like a hypocrite than a traditional shooter . You need to stick with iron sights if you want your statement to have validity . Just my .02 cents

+1..........

This last season I hunted with a smokeless inline MUZZLELOADER, albeit with open sights, because the MN DNR says that's what I can use during MUZZLELOADER SEASON. It's important to note that I did not hunt with a traditional gun because our state doesn't say it's a traditional season.
It's an old argument that will never go anywhere because people can't look beyond their own opinions. If you don't like the way your state defines a muzzleloader, get over it or move somewhere else. That's like me yelling at you because you were driving the speed limit in a blue car, even though I personally feel like you should have been driving slower in a red car. It's pretty childish.
I'll stop now.

We're all entitled to our opinions.

I disagree. Blue cars should not even be allowed on Interstate highways. :s2:

And some are more opinionated more than others! :)

Man its hard to stay nuetral all the time!

Dave...JW

It's much easier to stay at one end JW. :)

It seems to me the anti inline and smokeless opinions are irrelevant to the topic. The OP didn't specify what season it was for or what powder he plans on using.

The person who brought it back because of a issue with the modules has received some info that might be useful. I doubt the "opinions" would help him either unless you are familiar with the model and its short comings.

I just wanted to post in an 8 year old thread.

I don't think it matters what the OP is asking. He's long gone.

thank you grouse 45 for the info for joe at savage and for the other fella's the vent liner has been changed got a dozen of them shortly after i bought the gun hard to put my encore down been shooting it for 18 yrs with no problems the savage shoots good

10 ml
 

savage took care of the problem with the old ml1