I finally decided to buy a Savage Model 10. I bought the stainless/laminate stock version... Do you think I'll be happy with it.. Come on, let me hear it good and bad!!!

Since your ordered it, I hope you are... There are excellent shooters and will shoot the black powders just as well as the smokeless powders. With any muzzleloader, use caution and be careful when loading and shooting, smokeless or non smokeless.

They sure do shoot some impressive groups with them. And those that have them seem to like them. I will go on record that I am happy with the other ones even though they do not shoot smokeless. If I wanted to shoot smokeless I would get one of the centerfires off the rack. I would miss the smoke, stink, bark, and yes... even the cleaning.

Good luck with your new rifle.

JsmesB67,

Did you order it "sight unseen", or had you handled one at the local gun dealer's or something.
They're a nice gun and I've seen them and handled them. A gun dealer buddy of mine uses them exclusively.
I opted out for the TC Omega as I really don't care much for using smokeless in a muzzleloader. Kind of a take it or leave attitude I guess. I use smokeless 90% of the time in reloading and I'm not really sold on the idea in muzzleloaders much. Black powder, or it's substitutes, are pretty predictable. Smokeless powders, in conditions other than their intended applications, aren't always.
W296, for instance, unless loaded to it's max., can be dangerous regarding reduced loads. The company recommends nothing less than maximum loads.

I'm sure Savage, in this sue crazy world, did their homework when they designed the gun, but one of the posts on this site showed a Savage that had blown up using a "recommended charge" of smokeless.

I'm sure you're a safe loader & shooter, but that post kind of raised the hair on my neck a little.

I don't own one and don't know for sure, but I'd rather err on the side of skepticizm with smokeless.

Take care,
Bob

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I don't know if you'll be happy with it.... cuz' you never mentioned what powder-type you'll be stuffing down the bore... blackpowder-type or smokeless??????

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I don't know if you'll be happy with it.... cuz' you never mentioned what powder-type you'll be stuffing down the bore... blackpowder-type or smokeless??????
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Let me clarify... This will be my third M/L in the gun safe. Presently I have a TC Encore, and a Knight disc. I live in NJ so hunting deer with centerfire rifles is out of the guestion. I would like to shoot smokeless powder in my new gun... Something different and intriguing I guess.. I'm also tentatively planning a deer hunt to Nebraska during their M/L season. I killed an antelope in Wyoming a couple years ago with my Encore. Although the Encore delivers pie plate accuracy at 200 yds I'm not entirely comfortable with groups that big and I want to be more confident if a 200 yd. shot presents itself. I've even heard that the Savage is capable of producing accurate results at 300 yds.


[/quote]Did you order it "sight unseen", or had you handled one at the local gun dealer's or something.[/quote]

I ordered it sight unseen. Other than Savage's website pictures. And some word of mouth recomendations...

Bump

I was hoping for a different reply JsmesB67. I am not a proponent of smokeless powders in muzzleloaders.

The Savage bullets do fly faster than the Encore - however shots bordering on 300 yards with still-primitive rifle & bullet is very difficult to keep consistent. I'm not saying you made a mistake in your purchase - I'm just saying that fast muzzleloading bullets aren't always accurate. I hope you got a good one & everything works out for your long yardage Savage hunts.

Think you will like the savage,I have 2 of them and like them,have shot some one hole 3 -shot groups @100yds using smokless,clean shot and pyrodex-select.using the sst 250 gr bullets.
Check out Dougs message for some good info on the savage.
http://dougva.proboards34.com

I have the same gun and am very happy with it. The ability to shoot smokeless powder is a godsend, performance is outstanding, and the gun with smokeless powder is very economical to shoot with smokeless powder, which is a factor often overlooked when all people see is muzzle velocity. Smokeless is MUCH cheaper to shoot than any of the black powder "substitutes."

The Savage is the finest designed ML out there today, because the requirement to use smokeless precludes using lower quality materials and simplified design schemes that the 10ML-II weaker cousins routinely employ. The Savage has the best sealed breech system, because the bolt actually cams the primer into a "chamber" on the breechplug just like a CF bolt action rifle cams shut. The result is very little blowback. I can shoot 40 shots out of my Savage and have half the fouling I'd experience with my DISC in 5 shots. Primer extraction is also very positive because the bolt cams the primer out of the breechface when opened. The action is also totally sealed to the elements, which isn't as big a deal since smokeless isn't hygroscopic or corrosive if it does get wet.

The barrel is made of the same gun barrel steel that CF barrels are made of, not the much softer (and hence cheaper and easier to machine) steels common with typical ML rifles. The barrels are button rifled to the same tolerances as a CF barrel as well. The Savage is the only muzzleloader I've shot that I can't feel and variations in the barrel as I seat a bullet. The barrel is fully free floated and the rifle is pillar bedded just like the Savage CF rifles. The machineing and finish are superb, and the quality and appearance of the laminate stock is very good. Of course, nothing bad can be said about the now standard Accu-Trigger. User adjustable to a crisp, virtually creep-free 1.5lbs, it's the best non-set trigger on the ML market today, and certainly the best inline trigger available.

My only gripes about the gun are the lack of a decent recoil pad. The hard rubber "pad" the gun comes with is purely decorative, and with full house smokeless loads it'll get your attention really quick. The other gripe is that the action screw at the front of the trigger guard must be backed out a couple turns to get the bolt out, which disturbs the bedding of the action if not retightend to the same torque.

I also hear a lot of people bitch about the vent liner, which is a designed in wear item thats purpose is render breechplug life to an indefinate period. Savage recommend that the vent liner be removed and replaced every so many rounds or when accuracy drops off suddenly, which is supposedly between 50 and 200 rounds. I've never had one wear out yet, and I'm at about round 150 or so. My gun came with three vent liners, and replacement vent liners can be ordered from Savage for something like $4 for 2. Recently Savage developed a newer vent liner design using a much harder steel that lasts 500 or more shots. The hardened steel also remedied the problem of stripping out the allen head screw by not only being harder, but also by slightly deepening the recess. These vent liners are advertised on Randy Wakemans website and cost around $5 apiece I think.

Overall I'm very happy with my 10ML-II. It's MUCH more accurate than my DISC, much less finiky about loads as long as the bullet weight is kept toward the higher end (300 grain .45cal bullets).

Oh, and I mentioned the increased recoil above, but that need not be the case. It's very possible to load down to the more moderate velocities typical of BP (1500-1800fps) and actually have LESS recoil. Certainly a rifle shooting a 300 grain sabot at 2250fps with 40 grains of N110 is going to kick more than a 300 grain bullet at 1700fps with 100 grains of T7. That's about 32% more velocity. But if you keep the velocity with smokeless down to 1700fps you have all the performance of a typical muzzleloader with much less recoil because of the significantly reduced weight of powder used. To get 1700fps you'd need maybe 25-30 grains of N110, or roughly 1/4 the mass of powder needed to achieve the same velocity with T7. That 75 grain mass savings translates into less ejecta, which means less total recoil. I'd still recommend installing a good pad though. The Savage recoil pad still sucks.

Mike

Another good post Mike. All MLs have an unpleasant quirk or two. I'm still waiting for the "perfect' muzzleloader. My 58-cal T/C Renegade sidelock is about perfect now... cost me a different barrel, new ramrod, lock & trigger - plus a Sims Limbsaver Pad to make it a God-send ML rifle. My Omega will never be perfect due to the smallish trigger guard & plastic ignition-area components & slippery laminated forearm stock. I could pay $200 for a Teflon job to seal/cover/provide better gripping.... but did I ever tell you how cheap I get sometimes???..lol