200 yard accuracy
 

Has anyone achieved 200 yard accuracy with there bp? If so what is the gun and load u use?

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I am really doing well with both Remingtons and the one A&H. I shoot 200 every once in awhile just to see. My inlines are zeroed at 134 & 147 (if my memory is correct) yards and I am shooting 300 grain Noslers or Hornady XTP's in Nosler sabots pushed by 100 grains of t7-2f, with 209 ignition. The other bullet that I use is the 260 grain Nosler in the 24" Remington it is really hot and accurate. Same powder load.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I shot 200 yards one afternoon in the hay field just to see if it could be done. Whether you call spraying a paper plate accuracy (after a couple shot just to figure out the drop), well thats could be argued. I would guess that if I practiced a lot, I could shoot that distance. There are reports of some shooting much further then that even.

Where I hunt 90% of the time my shots are 80 yards and under. Only when I hunt the edges of the fields do I get anything even near long range, and then I doubt if I would take it....

But your right you guys, it is a lot of fun to try....

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

1 1/2"- 2" on a good day with 3"-4" on my not so good days. Took a yearling at 201 yds with my Omega and 105 gr of ffg 777 with a 245 gr Barnes Spitzer bullet. Drop is 7" with a 3" high at 100 yds zero.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

200yds with ONLY magnum capable BP rifles (150 grain loads in quality in-lines) is a VERY VERY capable proposition for most folks. I think alot of guys are under-estimating their own abilities as well as that of their guns. With something like a Encore/Omega/Knight Disc etc firing 150grn loads with 250grain bullets like SSTs or Barnes, the typical drop @ 200yds is 6" when sighted dead on @ 100yds. They drop like anvils once you cross the 225 range (but still are killable at 300 with practice) and I personally recommend something like a mil-dot setup. All of the above loads and guns will still produce around 1k ft pds of energy at 300yds so at 200yds they are more than adequate for deer sized game.

When dealing with loads under 130 grains of propellant I would recommend 150yds as the maximum for most shooters,
RA

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

we shot up a old school bus down in a pasture one day i guested the range about 6 or 7 hundred yards ,i was shooting a tc white mountain carbine,using homemade maxi balls i think they were about 325 or a little bigger with a 100 gr. of loose powder.We shot it a few times to see where the lead was landing there was water in the pasture so we could see the splash in the water i had to aim about 10 feet over the bus to hit it in the side under the windows,after a dozen or so shots and cleaning we put the hood around to the side ,we were hiting a spot about 3 feet in dia painted with black paint by aiming at the top of the buss,then i steped the range it was over a little over 600yards. I always wondered how thoes guys hit buffalo at extreme ranges just take a little time to learn how.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I disagree. "Most folks" I know shoot maybe 10 shots a year and some of those are at game. Your thinking drop only. At 200 yds a deer is a pretty small target even at 9X. It takes practice to make those kind of shots. I've put close to 200 rounds through my Omega this year and I know where it hits out to 200. I passed a nice buck the third day because it was at 231 yds and I had no idea where it shot at that range. I could have guessed (and a friend told me I should have), but I've got too much respect for my quarry to risk a shot if I don't know I could make it.

The guns are capable certainly. However the most important element is the shooter. If the shooter is not capable of the shot then the gun is irrelevant. Also a small point, without a range finder how far exactly is your animal? How do you know where to hold? Guessing an animal is at 200 when it's at 240 could lead to a miss or even worse, a crippled animal. What about wind? Wind is a bigger factor than drop at extreme ranges. What's your drift with a 10 mph wind? If you don't know then you could have a problem.

Why 130 gr of powder? Why is that the magic number? I read about a fellow taking a Nilgai at 300+ with 100 gr of Pyro and a 325 gr bullet. According to the shooter the bullet expanded properly. There is no magic number. I shot 105 gr. of 777 (Actually I weigh my powder and the weight was 85 gr.). According to your number I am way under powered. However my bullet still exited. I maintain the minimum energy out to just past 300 yds.

Simply put, the most important factor is the shooter. Always has been. Most shooters can make long shots but only after sufficent practice. There is no substitute for that.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

The last muzzleloader magazine had an article on shooting out to 300 yards and on wind drift and bullet drop. Good article to read even though with the old Hawken my range is 110 yrds or so.

Eric

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

thanks for replys

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I can proudly say yes. I have a .45 cal T/C Encore. I have a .25ACP breach plug from Precision Rifle, and a Weaver Grandslam 3.5-10 50MM scope. I'm shooting Precision Rifle dead center 175 Gr bullets. Backed with 130 Grains of powder. Once I found this load, I have not shot over 3'' groups at 250 yards. The best part is I have the gun sighted in at 200 yards. It hits 2'' high at 150yards, and 3'' low at 250. Precision Rifle are the guys to get in touch with for long range shooting. PrBullet.com

Note: Dead Center bullets are solid lead. Although I have not had a problem with them on deer size game, I would not recommend them for much more. I have shot deer at 40 yards with these bullets, small deer, and the bullets did not come out. At 100 yards the bullet performance was flawless, however I would not shot bigger game at close yardages.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Wolf I honestly dont think it took you 200rnds to figure out what your rifle was doing out too 200yds. Even when sighted dead on @ 100yds, an Omega with 209s, 150grn loads and a quality bullet like a 250SST will only drop 6". With a 9 power scope @ only 200yds that is what I consider a fairly easy shot.

How do I determine distance? The same way I thought ALL modern hunters do, with the assistance of a laser range finder. If you dont have one, then GET ONE! If you still refuse one then spend the time to pace off (or personally I would recommend using a fishing reel spooled with EXACTLY 100yds of line) various landmarks around your stands so you know how far, within appx 10yds, your quarry is.

I dont think that it is really that hard for ANYONE to shoot with magnum muzzleloaders out too 200yds. There simply isnt that much to worry about, and the big heavy bullets are suprisingly wind resistant to drift at such short yardages unless you are just really hunting in galeforce winds.

For over 200yd shooting, YES it takes practice, confidence in your equipment and yourself and by really good equipment you can maximize your chances. Afterall trophy hunting is a game of time and odds. So why not try and maximize ALL opportunities you are graced with? That is why I recommend a mil-dot scope, an afternoon or two on the range shooting in 25yd increments. After such a "session" I believe anyone can calmly put the pill in the breadbasket of a whitetail at much farther distances than previously believed.

As for the 130grn number, its a random one really. For all intents and purposes I wouldnt recommend ANYONE shooting over 200yds if they dont have at least 120grn loads onboard. 150yds for 100grn loads etc. The magic number IMHO is 6" of drop. Anything less than that is easily handled and compensated for by most shooters. Over that requires some practice and special tools. NOT special skills in my book!

Good luck,
RA

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Savage is a 200 yd + muzzleloader.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Been kinda interesting folks. My ole muzzleloader has never saw a shot on paper over 100yds., never have thought of attempting a farther one anyway. Kinda figured if I done my homework, wouldn't need to. That theory has always held true cause I've never shot a deer over 40-50yds. with one, most way under that. I am also intrigued by the paper work figures, cause I know with traditional every rifle is different. So there is no substitute for practice and finding the right load for your rifle. Wolf mentioned that he has already shot a couple hundred rounds through his this year, I like that. It would be a safe bet that he is a far better shot than your once a year man that goes out the week before season to see if his rifle is still shooting fair. I've seen alot of that. Just last weekend is a good example for my area. Drove by the local (members only) gun range and had to just shake my head, what normally is an empty place was wall to wall vehicles. Amazes me. I'm sure we've all heard "I don't know how I missed him" :D, I do. Anyway, just my 2 cents.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Red, I must say it took me about 200 shots to find the best combination. I shot 175 gr, 195 gr, 210 gr Precision rifle dead centers and the same combo in QT bullets all with 100,105,110,115,120...150. Thats 6 bullets, 10 powder combinations at 3 shots apeice. Thats 180 shots. Then put in testing on different powders(once I found optimum load); About 250. To know you have the best load possible you will have to shot this many shots. However, to know you have a 200 yard load you might not have to. On the other hand some people get lucky and find a really good one by luck.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

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My sidelock shoots 200 yards accurately & it doesn't need smokeless powder to do it.

IE.... Garage sale ($30) Traditions Deerhunter 50 percussion using 85 gr 777 FFF with 285 gr Buffalo S.S.B. 45/50 topped with a handgun Simmons 4X32 scope mounted around 1/2-way down the barrel.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Old David squeezed off on General Santa Anna at about 200 yards. General "Peacock" thought he was safe. Wind got up so the round ball only clipped the epaulet on his right shoulder. Old David didn't know that his old flintlock longrifle was sooooo inferior to the inlines so he took the shot anyway; but he knew where the bullet was hitting at that distance.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I have other muzzleloaders that don't need smokless powder either but they are not doing 2450 fps using a 250 gr bullet either,and they have to be cleaned afterwards too.
All are fun to shoot too.Neither will make a deer any deader than the other one either.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I set up 2 14' tripods on opposite ends of open field 3 years ago just for the 200 yrd shots with a smoke pole and 125 with slugger.

I have my Knight set up and shooting superbly at 110yrds. By this time next year it and I will be shooting at 200 yrds. IMO IF you have a love and intimacy with your smokepole any muzzle loader can cleanly take out a deer at 200yrds.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Hey Wolf,

All I read about last year was the PR bullets. I bought the 250 dead centers and shot three deer at less than 30 yards. Never a single pass thorough, I couldn't believe it.
I switched this year to the Knight red hot 250 made for Knight by Barnes. This is an awesome round. I shot one at 115 yds that not only passed through but completely blew the opposite side front leg off the deer on exit. It was just held on by skin. I hit another at 19 that passed through and looked as though I hit it with my 30-06. Awesome blood trails arnd easily recovered animals.

I have total respect for PR bulets, but would never switch back to them. They were extremely accurate, but most guys never have pass throughs with them, which results in less blood. There was a long thread on this last year if you do a search.

I shoot a .50 Knight Disc Extreme with 100 grain 777. Stainless synthetic w/ thumbhole stock

I can't shoot accurately much over 100yds because in WI we cannot have higher than 1X scopes. If we could have a magnified scope 200yds would not be an issue.

Cybersniper

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Herman, How many shots in that group? I only see two. Show me some sub MOA groups at 200yds with three or more rounds and you may turn me into a believer.

Cyber

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

If you look at the hole on the right side there are 2 bullets there.I assure you that there are 3 bullets in the group.
How many bullets can you count in the ground hog pic?This is my favorite load used it this year to take 3 deer one @234 yds.It is a different load than I used it the first pic.
The next pic is with a different load.Think you can clearly count to 3 there.Last pic is getting it zeroed @300,lots of holes there.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I have not practiced enough to shoot 200 yards.
I feel this is something you must do many times to get the feel before you try it on an animal.
I want to harvest an animal as cleanly as possible.
Not sayin that these shots ain't doable,but you must work up to them!

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Nice shootin' Herman.. ya' got that baby dialed-in!

Zak

250-300 yard shots with a ML needs ideal weather/terrain, a sharpshooter, a top-tier gun & 150 gr. loads. IF you don't have those four ingredients - don't even mess with trying it. Smokeless Savages are nice/advantageous, but if you can see your harvest fall upon firing, then it ain't no smokepole. They will remain legal in shotgun/smokepole hunting zones until enough blood is shed to outlaw them. It is unfortunate that our laws won't change until innocent folks sitting in their living rooms watching TV get shot.... but that's how the system works with our government.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

That's some nice shooting Herman! It would even be nice if you were using a centerfire rifle. I'm impressed

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Zak you are right it takes a lot of practice.I put over a 1000 rounds through the 2 savages I have this year.I shoot once a week usually outside of deer season,with lots of different calibers.These shots were off a bench.The deer I took @234yds I rested off the window seal from a blind,if I had had to shoot off hand I would never attemped the shot.Shot one off hand that was at a trot @65yds through the shoulder and one standing still in the head @35 yds.
If I had of practiced with my encore or ruger I could have done the same with them.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I don't really care for the PR bullets. They're overpriced for what you get. They also have over inflated BC's. The Barnes 250's are also pricey, but they are awesome on deer. One of the better muzzleloading bullets if you ask me. I don't shoot em anymore, but it's not because I don't like em.

You may also want to try the Winchester Platinum tips. That's what I'm shooting in my Extreme (same model as yours) and I average 1 1/2" groups. Although not the best shooting bullet for my rifle, they are impressive on deer and 1/2 the price of the Barnes (which are the best shooting out of my Extreme). I figure the deer won't notice the 1/2" difference in groups.;)

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Thanks for the tip, I'm willing to experiment and will give them a try.

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

I just bought my first mz this fall (Austin & Halleck 320 Black) and am experimenting with different loads, etc. The drawback we face in Minnesota for hunting is that it's open sights only. At this point, I'm just getting comfortable shooting to 70 to 100 but am looking forward to experimenting and learning more as I go. Thanx to all here for the knowledge transfer!!

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Iron,

We have the same law here, nothing higher than 1X scope. I used a red dot last year and a Holosight this year. They are much better than iron sights and faster to come on target. If they will allow it in your state they work pretty well.

Cybersniper

RE: 200 yard accuracy
 

Oh please! Fist of all, there are muzzleloaders that achieve velocities within 200 fps of the Savages smokeless loads. Secondly, your argument is baseless, since there is no more likely a chance that there will be a stray bullet from a Savage than from a Knight. On top of that, you are doing what so many ignorant antis do and blame the gun instead of the shooter for any accident that occurs. If a hunter puts a bullet through someones living room it is because he was negligent/reckless and didn't know what was behind his target and assure a solid backstop. I'd also like you to find me ONE SHRED OF EVIDENCE that innocent bystanders are in greater danger from a Savage than from any other "magnum" muzzleloader. Unfortunately for you and your baseless argument and blatantly biased position, I don't think such evidence exists.

And ask yourself this question...who is more dangerous; a hunter with a Savage muzzleloader with, like any other muzzleloader, one and only one shot to take on a target, or a shotgun hunter who is able to blast out 5+ 3" magnum sabot slugs at a running deer that are currently achieving velocities of 2000fps or more?

But like it or not, they are still a muzzleloader. I can't understand why there is so much division and infighting among our ranks, considering the Savage is no less a muzzleloader than a Brown Bess musket. Maybe we should ban Triple Seven and 150 grain charges before "innocent folks sitting in their living rooms watching TV get shot" and because it gives you an "unfair" advantage over those who choose to hunt with smoothbore flintlock muskets. Oh wait, did I say CHOOSE. Maybe we should quit nitpicking and allow people to hunt with whatever they CHOOSE to hunt with, as long as it loads from the front, even if some people don't like it? Wouldn't that be a novel concept...I think they call it "freedom."

Man, I just don't get some people.

Mike