newguy23

What is your feelings on Pioneer powder, I had a talk with my father today and he went into a rant about how Pyrodex is the 800 pound gorilla when in actuallity the Pioneer stuff burns much cleaner... Any opinions?

cayugad

American Pioneer Powder used to be called Clean Shot Powder. They got into a legal battle with Pyrodex when they introduced pellets or something as I remember. They then as many companies do when in legal troubles, re-organize and change their name.

Pioneer Powder I believe is a sugar based powder. And yes it burns cleaner then Pyrodex. You still have to clean the rifle. From what some have told me if you shoot Pioneer Powder be very careful of moisture, ie: rain and snow days, fog and damp conditions. It seems to draw moisture. All powders do, but some more so then others.

I have some clean shot powder here at the house and it shoots fine. When I run out, I have no intention of getting anymore. It was on sale and I bought it. It shoots fine. I have not hunted with it, but I am sure it would work just fine. This is not something I would use in a flinter, but for a side lock or in line it will be fine.

It is just a hair less powderful then Pyrodex. In fact measure it the same as you would Pyrodex, it is that close. Another good powder out there for those that hate to clean their rifles is Triple Se7en. It cleans up with just water and is 15% stronger then Pyrodex in loose form....

By the way, I use Goex Black Powder. Cleaning these rifles is all part of the sport.....

johnch

Pioneer powder has 50 gr "stichs" ,I have not tryed it ,I use 777 pellets . If it is the same as the old Clean shot powder I tryed it years ago (loose) it worked good but the next spring I reopened the sealed bottle to find a 1/2 lb solid mass of what used to be powder ,I talked to others that use it ,they agreed that after 6-8 months ,throw away what is left . Maybee they have solved this problem.

cayugad

john... as strange as this might sound, I have had an opened bottle of Clean Shot (when it was called clean shot... that's how old it is) around the house for years. I shot some this year just to see if it was still good, and it functioned perfect. After I opened the bottle since I had no horn for the stuff, I poured it into an big empty (cleaned and dried of course) plastic ketchup bottle with a flip top spout. It has been in there ever since, and stored on the shelf in the gun room. So what I am getting at is I have not experienced the moisture problem that others have advised me of. I still would not purchase any more of it only because I like using real black powder much more then any other propellant....

Triple Se7en

Cayugad

Your Clean Shot loaded bore needs to remain outdoors with moisture surroundings in order to witness it's lessening/hangfire effects along with dripping/droplets of powder when the muzzle is pointed downwards after hunting in wet conditions.

My tests were conducted/proven with it's sister (American Pioneer) last fall. I left the two front doors of my pickup open with the tightly-capped powder on the rain-protected front seat for a few hours along with subjecting it to a couple of mild (25 degree) temperature changes moving it from auto to trailer... back to auto. That's all it took to create a non-working environment.

newguy23

Is it true that the Pioneer burns much cleaner than the triple seven... I have heard that you can shoot many rounds with the pioneer without cleaning.

Triple Se7en

Yes it does shoot cleaner than 777. If you only plan on ML hunting during normal weather conditions, AP FFF performed flawlessly in my T/C Omega. It's power was equal to Pyrodex/Goex while it remained dry. Don't buy the FF... it's real coarse... won't even pour from my brass flask.

cayugad

Triple Se7en your correct in that I have never hunted or shot the clean shot in wet conditions. When I first got the stuff a store went out of business and I bought two pounds of it for $10.00. I did shoot it a lot at the house here, target shooting. For some reason I never did want to try it hunting. I guess after reading that all you need do is hunt or target shoot in the rain or snow and the moisture problems happen, I am glad I never did. I still have almost a full bottle of the stuff left. I shot it earlier this year when this topic came up to see what age does to the powder. If did fine. Maybe the next misty/light rain day happens and I will have to test your theory..

Also I agree in the FFg size. That is what I have and it is about the size of gravel at times....

AJ52

I've used 120-130 grains of loose Clean Shot/Pioneer FF for 5 yrs in my Knight 45. Knight recommended by phone - and - sent me ballistics chart showing improved muzzle and fps ratings with clean shot over pyrodex. The stuff has always shot flawlessly in the field,including some wet conditions. FF is very coarse and hard to pour from flask into speed loader - and - then try to pour into muzzel. I've thought about trying the FFF just for that reason.

I store it in a dry moisture free environment along with my black powder. With the exception of BP I routinly buy new powder every 3rd year no matter what.

AJ52

Triple Se7en,

I see you've used the AP FFF. What kind of load were you using? I'm thinking about trying some FFF.