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I use 100 grains in my Remington model 700ML. It works well. 3 shots = same hole at 100yds.

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A fast bullet is no good if it isn't accurate . Experiment with the bullet of your choice and the amount of powder. I shoot a 240 gr TC sabot with the Hornaday XTP bullet and 90 gr of 777. It hits where I aim and I dropped a doe in her tracks at 80 yards. Using a max load of powder might be detrimental to the accuracy of your rifle.

I presently use 110 grs of Pyrodex behind a 405 gr. powerbelt for elk. I doubt you will every hear any knowledgeable muzzleloader recommend a certain grain in all situations. I am no expert, but what I have heard them say is to start at 90 grains and work up to a MAX of 150 grains with the bullets you will be using. Then use the bullet/powder combination that is most accurate for your gun. EVERY GUN IS DIFFERENT, and that includes 2 of the same make and model. Just like rifles, each gun has a load that it likes the best, so you have to do a lot of experimenting.

The 150 grain max load doesn't apply to the new Triple 7 powder because a smaller VOLUMN of 777 equals a pyrodex/blackpowder eqivalent. Seems like people have said to use 15-20% less 777 by volumn to get the same ballistics/velocities.

I have two inlines, a T/C Black Diamond XR and a CVA Staghorn. The Black Diamond shoots a good group with the T/C Shockwaves all the way up to 120 grains of Pyrodex RS. I was shooting the Triple Se7en out of it and it seemed to shoot fine with 100 grains of T-7 which would be close to the charge of Pyrodex used. Anything above that and I got fliers.

When I shot the 295 aero tip power belts I tried 100 grains of Triple Se7en and was not impressed with the group at all. I think if I cut the charge back some, it would have gotten better but I ran out of projectiles to continue further testing and the next batch I want to try are the 348's.

In the manual of the CVA Staghorn 209 Magnum it states that the only 150 grain charge of power they consider safe is from three Pyrodex 50 grain Pellets. All loose Pyrodex must not exceed 100 grains. Triple Se7en therefore should not exceed 85 grains if the conversion tables are right. I shot the 295 grain powerbelts using 100 grains of TripleSe7en ( not even realizing I was shooting a "unsafe charge actually until it was pointed out to me by another poster.) and the groups were terrible. Yet this rifle with 90 grains of Pyrodex RS and a 240 grain T/C CheapShot will shoot a excellent group.

So even through the rifle is a magnum rifle, that does not mean you will get the best results with a magnum charge. All rifles are different your correct in that statement. As you said, all you can do is play with the load and see what works best.

By the way, how do the 405 grain powerbelts shoot? What kind of rifle are you shooting? And do you shoot pellets or loose? I am always intersted in learning someone elses tricks...

Presently I am shooting 110 grains of loose pyrodex select powder from a T/C renegade with a 405 hollowpoint black belt (powerbelt) with the copper jacket. I get about a 2" group at 50 yards and a 4" group at 100 yards with a peep rear/ fiberoptic front sight. Since my personal limit on this rig is 80 yards, I feel comfortable with this set up.

In my knight disc rifle, my favorite bullets (250 grain barnes expanders) shoot 1" groups with 150 grains (pellets). These same bullets shoots about 21/2" groups with 100 grains. On the other hand, I have not been able to get 300 grain or heavier bullets to shoot as well with 150 grains. They seem to better with a lighter load. I guess the point is you have to experiment and find what your gun likes. Fortunately, the barnes expanders perform so well I have no reason to change unless I am elk hunting in which case I live the 2" to 3" groups the 300 grain expanders make with 150 grain load (elk are a big enough target that within muzzleloader ranges, that they are more than accurate enough). I think that absolute consistency in the cleanliness of the bore is critcal to tight groups. Without cleaning the barrel, the 1" groups open up to 2+". It might pay to take extra precautions to ensure your barrel is in the same condition for each shot. The only way I know to do this is to get the barrel completely clean--otherwise it is difficult to compare the condition.

Every rifle is an individual. What shoots well in one rifle may not shoot well in another. Twist rate, rifling depth, width of lands and grooves, even the amount of polish in the bore will change the way each bullet will shoot. Generally the magnum loads only work with sabots. Conicals have a habit of stripping if the load is too heavy. The most important thing is to work up an accurate powder/bullet combo. The selling point of the magnum loads is velocity. Everybody wants you to be able to shoot like Quigly without having to adjust for bullet drop. Modest charges can be very lethal. Remember, guides for dangerous game often rely on a 45-70. That name stood for 45cal with 70gr blackpowder in the cartridge. I don't know too many people that claim the 45-70 lacks effectiveness.