If I do sell my Savge, I would have $400 to replace it with, not a penny more. What would you get? Don't need to save money for a scope since MN doesn't allow them. I like the speed breach since the whole reason I got the savage was no cleaning, so anything that will speed up cleaning time would be great. Other than that, it's open. What do you think?

If I had $400 in hand to spend on a muzzleloader, I would be trolling GunBroker for a T/C Omega with a laminate stock.

Reasons:
1. I like the wood. Most accurate and looks the best (IMO)
2. Very accurate once you figure the right load
3. Easy to clean. Does not have the speed breech, but once you get home, a wrench takes it off quick and then clean up is easy, just swabbing the barrel and cleaning the breech plug.

Note, I already have an Omega X7, the carbine version of the Omega, but am looking to pick up the standard with a laminate stock. New, I think they are overpriced, but I realy like the simplicity of the design which will serve as a lifetime gun.

My second choice would also be from GunBroker, a Knight, (either the Elite or Extreme). On that I would settle for the composite stock.

I am a big fan of buying used but have to admit there is a higher risk factor with muzzleloaders.

Here is a laminate Omega for $400. The same store also sells the old Accura version for less than $400. The plain Triumph is also around $400, but some, including me, cannot use the Triumph iron sights, because of the high comb. The Accura V2 can be had for right around $400, but i can't say anything good or bad about that rifle yet.

SuperKirby

I am totally biased, I admit that fact right off the bat... Of the new guns available right right now - I would also go with the TC Omega SS, but I would opt for the composite stock, because we have lousy weather here durinf hunting season, and to further complicate things I would be after a thumbhole stock.

Here is an example of what I woud be after - I am a plain jane type of guy so this ordinary Omega would work for me...

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/33813

I would really go after this one...

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/16869

If you are willing to purchased used - look at a Knight DISC Extreme/Elite and if you are a whitetail hunter look hard for a 45 cal... awesome shooters...

But one of your stipulations was easy to clean... I really do not find the Knight hard to clean and most folks think that the break open are easier.

CVA Accura V2 or a new Optima along with a nice set of mounts and a scope

Well, that's what I'd get right there. So who has the $400 to give me?

Better hurry hubby. That link shows they have only 42 in stock.

That SS/Laminate Omega may be the best gun out there. I love my X7.

superkerby,

Of course this is just my opinion, but that's what you asked for. Right now none of the new guns on the market really interest me at all. If I was in your shoes, I'd be looking for a Knight Disc, a 700ML or a White. All of those are EXTREMELY accurate guns and are time tested. None have a speed breech but I don't find any of them hard to clean. I find it takes me just as long to clean the triumph as it does any other gun.

That's my $0.02.

I found my knight disc as "new," there are plenty of old stock guns out there if you look. I will after seeing that deal on that omega I kinda wish that I would've looked around before I bought my accura.. I much prefer some type of wood stock over tupperware. Might have to find a new home for the accura after early season....

So, I have a Disc Extreme. Haven't spent a lot of time with it, and I should.
So now the real problem. Yesterday I found a T/C Encore for 349 new. Only problem is, it will be about a week before I get the money for it, and this is the only one in the store. The guy said he'd hold it for me for $100, but I can't swing that just yet. I'm trying to figure out something though.