anyone use the leupold ultimate slam muzzleloader scope?
11-10-2009, 10:46 AM
#11
Fork Horn
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 126
Deer vitals are about a 5 inch circle. If you know the trajectory of your ML, hold over estimates should be easy without the need of scopes with trajectory reticules.
The average whitetail is 36 to 40 inches at the shoulder.
My ML drops about 3.5 inches at 200 yards if zeroed at 100
The average whitetail is 36 to 40 inches at the shoulder.
My ML drops about 3.5 inches at 200 yards if zeroed at 100
Last edited by thom2; 11-10-2009 at 10:50 AM.
11-10-2009, 11:02 AM
#12
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Breechplug
I am certainly no expert... but I really do not think so... Most American scope manufactures put the reticule ahead of the power ring, while European scopes are the opposit and the reticule changes with power. You can actually see it change as you move the Power Ring - I do not see that in the Leupold.
Also look on your Power Ring - you will see 2 small Gold Dots and in another place where there are 3 Gold Dots. All of this computes into the settings of the rings.
As i understand it???? the range lines represent a certain distance between lines when on 9 power. Same way with a mil-dot or even the Nikon Omega... but to be honest with you I have never read the directions because it did not mean a thing to me as I use the scope differently than designed.
When I sighted the scope in - I laser bore sighted it here at home then on 9x shoot a 25 yard target - then a 100 yard target - then the rest of the targets.
In real life about the only time I would ever use 9x is for a 175 plus yard shot when I was on a rest... other than I am somewhere between 3 and 5 power depending on the terrain.
OK - I just looked again - The reticule does not change size - but the distance between dots does change and is only constant on one power setting - so 9x is the suggested power to achieve the range distance indicated.
All to complicated for me - I just use the marks to fit my needs...
They told me that when I change power on the scope the reticle lines, or dots also change from closer to further apart depending on what power you choose. This may be wrong but that's what they told me.
Also look on your Power Ring - you will see 2 small Gold Dots and in another place where there are 3 Gold Dots. All of this computes into the settings of the rings.
As i understand it???? the range lines represent a certain distance between lines when on 9 power. Same way with a mil-dot or even the Nikon Omega... but to be honest with you I have never read the directions because it did not mean a thing to me as I use the scope differently than designed.
So say I had a close shot at 20yds, 9 power would be way too much to use as the target would be way too close. So I could'nt sight in the way they said using 9 power, then change it to say 2 power for a close shot as my marks would be off.
In real life about the only time I would ever use 9x is for a 175 plus yard shot when I was on a rest... other than I am somewhere between 3 and 5 power depending on the terrain.
OK - I just looked again - The reticule does not change size - but the distance between dots does change and is only constant on one power setting - so 9x is the suggested power to achieve the range distance indicated.
All to complicated for me - I just use the marks to fit my needs...
11-10-2009, 11:23 AM
#13
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 159
I am the proud owner of at least 10 of them and dollar for dollar you can't beat them..period.. I've never as much as had one single problem with any of them.. they are bright, clear and I've never had one move a single in of impact on their own..I mounted a 3x9 Ultimate Slam on my bone collector and have around 100 shots on it.. it still hits exactly where it's supposed to and the dots are absolutely perfect... the nikon is a great scope also BUT the semicirculars are all the same size and when your shooting far the circles darn near covers the whole deer.. the stagered of the Leupold dot make precise aiming alot easier in my opinion.. I just wonder if all these problem listed above are precieved or actual.. there's alot of things that can change impact points, stock, dirty barrel, loose mount and rings, improper cleaning techniques etc... but bad mouthing a scope company is easy, I'd but another one in a second without hesitation... the Ultimate Slam 3x9 is perfect for any slug gun or muzzloader, buy it and you'll never regret it...
11-10-2009, 11:43 AM
#14
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 247
Breechplug is right about adjusting the power and the marks moving farther and closer apart with power setting changes, here a snipit from a article that explains it better---
The one thing that people using BDC scopes typically have problems with is that a BDC scope has the reticle in the second focal plane of the scope. If the reticle was in the first focal plane of the scope the reticle would look smaller on low powers like 3x and grow proportionately larger as the power increased to say 9x top power. The problem is that while the marks on the BDC reticle correspond accurately to the bullet drop at the know distances 200, 300yds etc. What happens when you lower the power from the scopes maximum power to any other lower power is the reticle stays the same size and the field of view within the scope increases which means that the distance between these marks on the BDC reticle no longer corresponds to the point where the bullet will strike. In short BDC reticles only work at the maximum power of the scope or at a set specific power. At all other powers these BDC reticles do not accurately represent where the bullet will strike.
Heres the link to the article
http://www.ehow.com/how_4534639_bdc-...g-reticle.html
I talked to guys at Leupold and Nikon while having both the U-Slam and Omega on the Triumph, and the scopes are designed excatly the same way. People make it way harder than it has to be to set it up and work with ANY LOAD COMBO your shooting.
The one thing that people using BDC scopes typically have problems with is that a BDC scope has the reticle in the second focal plane of the scope. If the reticle was in the first focal plane of the scope the reticle would look smaller on low powers like 3x and grow proportionately larger as the power increased to say 9x top power. The problem is that while the marks on the BDC reticle correspond accurately to the bullet drop at the know distances 200, 300yds etc. What happens when you lower the power from the scopes maximum power to any other lower power is the reticle stays the same size and the field of view within the scope increases which means that the distance between these marks on the BDC reticle no longer corresponds to the point where the bullet will strike. In short BDC reticles only work at the maximum power of the scope or at a set specific power. At all other powers these BDC reticles do not accurately represent where the bullet will strike.
Heres the link to the article
http://www.ehow.com/how_4534639_bdc-...g-reticle.html
I talked to guys at Leupold and Nikon while having both the U-Slam and Omega on the Triumph, and the scopes are designed excatly the same way. People make it way harder than it has to be to set it up and work with ANY LOAD COMBO your shooting.
Last edited by revpilot; 11-10-2009 at 11:47 AM.
11-10-2009, 12:36 PM
#15
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 6,585
I tried one Leupold on a muzzleloader and it lost its innards after about 18 months. I keep it and the other ones that have fail in use with out a good reason in a special drawer and go through it periodically to remind myself what to stay away from.
11-10-2009, 12:36 PM
#16
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
revpilot
I think - I thought that is wat I was trying to say... the reticule does not change size but the distance between marks does. It is absolute at 9x.
But, theoretically... if you chose to do so you could shoot and set it up on any power that you choose - then you would have to shoot it in from there.
Got to find the directions and read what the 'dot' marks on the power ring means.
Even if you shot the recommended 250 grain bullet and 150 grains of powder - they would not all be the same. Bullet BC, 150 grains of which powder, shooting elevation - they also be factors...
Gotta go find the directions...
I think - I thought that is wat I was trying to say... the reticule does not change size but the distance between marks does. It is absolute at 9x.
But, theoretically... if you chose to do so you could shoot and set it up on any power that you choose - then you would have to shoot it in from there.
Got to find the directions and read what the 'dot' marks on the power ring means.
Even if you shot the recommended 250 grain bullet and 150 grains of powder - they would not all be the same. Bullet BC, 150 grains of which powder, shooting elevation - they also be factors...
Gotta go find the directions...
11-10-2009, 01:03 PM
#17
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
OK - You have forced me to read the directions...
Here is what Leupold has to say...
So in theory you have 3 different factory loads that the Leupold will handle - that's Theory...
All to complicated for me... And since I don ot shoot pointy bullets - I shoot my load then test at 9x power the longer ranges to see where they actually hit...
If you are interested pages 40 and 41 provide an alternative way of sighting in.. which is basically what I think I am doing.
Here is what Leupold has to say...
The leupold SAbot Ballistic Reticue provides you with three different power positions, indicated by 2 pellets, 3 pellets, and a shotgun shel on the (power ring) within the magnification level indicators. These are provided to allow you to select the hold points best suited to the laod you are using. The reticule assumes polymer-tipped sabots will be used throughout. As an example a .50 cal sabot with a 250 grain 45 cal Hornady SST/ML bullet exiting muzzle at 2200 fps (3 pellets/150 grain of powder) would require the use of 3 pellets setting. The same sabot/bullet combination with a muzzle velocity of 1890 fps (2 pellets/10 grains of powder) would require the use of the 2 pellet setting. 12 guage shotgun applications would use the shotgun shell setting, a 350 grain FPB at 1950 fps is ideally suited for use on the 12-gauge setting, and a 20-gauge shotgun loads would use the 2 pellet muzzleloader setting.
All to complicated for me... And since I don ot shoot pointy bullets - I shoot my load then test at 9x power the longer ranges to see where they actually hit...
If you are interested pages 40 and 41 provide an alternative way of sighting in.. which is basically what I think I am doing.
Last edited by sabotloader; 11-10-2009 at 01:10 PM.
11-10-2009, 02:12 PM
#18
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
Breechplug, wanted me to post this picture for him
So here it is - I think he will follow with an explanation...
Mike would you post this pic for me on the Forum about has anyone used the Ultimate Slam ML Scope? The target was at 100yds and I was using the first (black dot) on the reticle to see where I would hit. The 5 shot group at the top was with the scope, the bottom shot was open sights. Just to show the scope is a good one and so is the accura.
So here it is - I think he will follow with an explanation...
Mike would you post this pic for me on the Forum about has anyone used the Ultimate Slam ML Scope? The target was at 100yds and I was using the first (black dot) on the reticle to see where I would hit. The 5 shot group at the top was with the scope, the bottom shot was open sights. Just to show the scope is a good one and so is the accura.
Last edited by sabotloader; 11-10-2009 at 05:46 PM.
11-10-2009, 02:47 PM
#20
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
I have a leupold Ultimate Slam ML Scope on one of My ACCURA's. So far I put about 120 shots through the Ml and scope and have had no problems with the scope. Im getting 1" 5 shot groups at 100yds using it.
But had I known (should have known better, because I did know) that the scope is set up for a 250gr Bullet using 150gr's of powder and have the scope set on 9 Power to get the scope to work as it's suppos-to. If you dont use this load you'll have to guess as to where to hold using the SABR reticle, and that defeats the pourpose of using the scope, or buying one. For me Im using 105 gr's of Pyrodox RS with a 240gr XTP Mag, so I had to sight in with that load. Then for the marks on the SABR I did this for the scope to work for my load.....I used the circle cross for 100yds, then I seen where my load would hit for the bottom of the circle and noted where I hit. Then for the first black circle I shot to see where I'd hit using that and noted it, and I did the same for the bottom black circle. So my marks are sort of custom settings using the SABR Reticle as I did not use the recommended load. The scope is not for everyone unless you use 150grs of powder and a 250gr Bullet. And their recommended load is way too much powder for your best accuracy and recoli. That's why me using 105grs had to sight in the way I did to be able to use the scope. Why shoot 150grs of powder and have your bullets going all over with no consistant group and having this nice scope makes no sence. Would I buy this scope again, no, I'd buy a regular (non ballistics aiming scope) and sight in 2" high at 50yds and go Hunting, much easier. Also uless you really need to shoot out past 125-150yds, and your using 150gr's of powder and a 250gr bullet then you dont need this scope.
Is it a well built clear scope, yes, is it for everyone, no. Sorry Leupold, nice scope but not user friendly.
(BP)
But had I known (should have known better, because I did know) that the scope is set up for a 250gr Bullet using 150gr's of powder and have the scope set on 9 Power to get the scope to work as it's suppos-to. If you dont use this load you'll have to guess as to where to hold using the SABR reticle, and that defeats the pourpose of using the scope, or buying one. For me Im using 105 gr's of Pyrodox RS with a 240gr XTP Mag, so I had to sight in with that load. Then for the marks on the SABR I did this for the scope to work for my load.....I used the circle cross for 100yds, then I seen where my load would hit for the bottom of the circle and noted where I hit. Then for the first black circle I shot to see where I'd hit using that and noted it, and I did the same for the bottom black circle. So my marks are sort of custom settings using the SABR Reticle as I did not use the recommended load. The scope is not for everyone unless you use 150grs of powder and a 250gr Bullet. And their recommended load is way too much powder for your best accuracy and recoli. That's why me using 105grs had to sight in the way I did to be able to use the scope. Why shoot 150grs of powder and have your bullets going all over with no consistant group and having this nice scope makes no sence. Would I buy this scope again, no, I'd buy a regular (non ballistics aiming scope) and sight in 2" high at 50yds and go Hunting, much easier. Also uless you really need to shoot out past 125-150yds, and your using 150gr's of powder and a 250gr bullet then you dont need this scope.
Is it a well built clear scope, yes, is it for everyone, no. Sorry Leupold, nice scope but not user friendly.
(BP)
I completely disagree with this!
You cannot for a moment, pretend that ANY ballistic reticle (short of one designed for the military) is going to be dead nuts on the money.... because every barrel and every gun is different.... even with the same load.
I have a Vortex on my Omega with their version of the BDC (which I can see ten times better than any other manufacturers... and thats why I bought it... I don't care for the Nikon BDC reticle as you won't be able to see it at last light).
I am shooting 80grs of BH209, with a 240 XTP, zeroed at 100 yards and at 150 yards.... my gun is dead on using the 125 yard hold mark. Strange, but true.
Basically.... all that shooting a different load did was make you shoot your gun more... all the while making you more confident and comfortable with it. You were able to basically 'custom fit' the scope to your gun. Most people just blindly go on faith and blame the equipment when they whiff a shot at 150 yards (most folks like that can't shoot and have no business shooting that far).
It sounds to me like the Leupold just made a better shooter and better hunter out of you. All positive things my man!
