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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: sabotloader Powerfisher it looks like you are quoteing me as saying.... Fact is I like the Lehigh bullets better than the Barns all copper because they will do the same job with out leaving copper in my barrel. SWThomas, what was wrong? My quote from the wrong person (which I admit) or that the Barnes will leave copper fouling in the bore? Which I dont understand? Just trying to learn so dont be too hard on me. [/align] |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Powerfisher,
That was me that said that I reload and shoot some cartridge competition to and the barns all copper copper coated my .270 and my .223 barrels, so I decided I did not care for them. I found a wide variation in weight also, the all brass or gilded are better. Lee |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Thanks Lee. My reading comprehension isnt the best at times so the copper fouling confused me. Thanks for clearing it up for me. I thought that somehow I was missing the the tell-tale blue-hue from the copper. This post stirred up a lot of questions. Sorry I got off topic.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spaniel
I would think it fair that a SST/SW, Barnes, etc may shed some weight but is not DESIGNED to fragment. This is the best definition we have heard so far - of those bullets and I would even go so far as to say any normally accepted American Big Game hunting bullet. Any bullet will fragment if you shoot it fast enough. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Still holding out for the pics of the fragmented Barnes bullets. I have yet to see a barnes ML bullet loose any part of itself other than the polimer tip.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: SWThomas Still holding out for the pics of the fragmented Barnes bullets. I have yet to see a barnes ML bullet loose any part of itself other than the polimer tip. I would suggest finding something else to do. The people that use the Barnes bullets already know the bullets mentioned don't have polymer tips. Also it was my mistake to even bring that up on this board. All information i posted was false and i have no pictures to back it up. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: sabotloader spaniel I would think it fair that a SST/SW, Barnes, etc may shed some weight but is not DESIGNED to fragment. This is the best definition we have heard so far - of those bullets and I would even go so far as to say any normally accepted American Big Game hunting bullet. Any bullet will fragment if you shoot it fast enough. I would also second this thought into a difficult medium while it has sufficient energy... |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: Grouse45 ORIGINAL: SWThomas Still holding out for the pics of the fragmented Barnes bullets. I have yet to see a barnes ML bullet loose any part of itself other than the polimer tip. I would suggest finding something else to do. The people that use the Barnes bullets already know the bullets mentioned don't have polymer tips. Also it was my mistake to even bring that up on this board. All information i posted was false and i have no pictures to back it up. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Ya know SWthomas. I just went back & read this entire thread. I didnt see anything said b Grouse or anyone else that could have offended you. So I just have to assume you,re just a Miserable PRICK. Get a life dude. Pull the big giant stick out your butt, go kick your dog, fight with your wife or what ever you need to do, but lighten up. Holy christ you are just a big giant turd, in the punch bowl of life. Im sure this post is gonna get me booted ,so you boys be safe & thanks for all the great info. Jay
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Im sure this post is gonna get me booted ,so you boys be safe & thanks for all the great info. Jay |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: burntmuch Ya know SWthomas. I just went back & read this entire thread. I didnt see anything said b Grouse or anyone else that could have offended you. So I just have to assume you,re just a Miserable PRICK. Get a life dude. Pull the big giant stick out your butt, go kick your dog, fight with your wife or what ever you need to do, but lighten up. Holy christ you are just a big giant turd, in the punch bowl of life. Im sure this post is gonna get me booted ,so you boys be safe & thanks for all the great info. Jay |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Im not on Grouses nuts. Actually I think his posts are pretty longwinded. & Im probably never gonna use the lehighs. A bit pricey for me. But everything he posts is pretty informative. I dont think Ive ever read a post of yours that offer any thing but negativity. Do You have to get online to be a prick. Are the people around you sick of you so you have to log on & be prick. Oh yeah {douchebag } I havent been called that since JR high.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
This is my last post o this thread, I apoligize to you guys. Just in my opinion Theres enough negativity in the world. I come here to escape that to a degree. Sorry [8D]if that sounded corny
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: burntmuch Im not on Grouses nuts. Actually I think his posts are pretty longwinded. & Im probably never gonna use the lehighs. A bit pricey for me. But everything he posts is pretty informative. I dont think Ive ever read a post of yours that offer any thing but negativity. Do You have to get online to be a prick. Are the people around you sick of you so you have to log on & be prick. Oh yeah {douchebag } I havent been called that since JR high. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
well now, I may just have to give some of those Leigh bullets a try. You all know how i like the odd ball projectiles so why the heck not? My Accura is a sweetie to shoot and i do enjoy trying many bullets out there.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
I agree. I remember when I got into BP. I was on another site posting on their forum. I got ruffed up a bit. Being so green and not so brightI felt like a target. I believe it was Lee or Bronko who recomended this site to me. Untill this particular thread was posted, everybody seemed to be here to learn and teach. There are a lot of opinions here. There are a few cyber bullies on this site but it hasnt gone too far untill now. Some of the folks here are very opinionated and others listen, teach and learn. Nobody knows it all. Burntmuch, I wont cast my vote on you either. You are welcome on my island any time. SW, you jumped my post cuzI made an error and still havent told me what was wrong with it. Was it the mis-quote that I posted or was it the copper fouling in the barrel? All you said was, "QUOTE" "Yeah, it was posted by lemoyne. And it's wrong."What was wrong? That kinda rubbed me the wrong way. Quick to criticize. How about offering some constructive criticism and helping out the guys like me that are new to the obsession of MLing. Perhaps its not your fault. Perhaps you are pre-menopausal or in full stage. Who knows. But I agree with burntmuch, lighten up. This forum is for teaching, learning and sharing experiences, not bullying folks around. Grouse45 may have his opinions and some facts. I may not agree with him, but im not bashing him either. Have fun with this one, just my $.02
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: SWThomas Okay. If you were just talking out of your arse and don't have any evidence to prove your claim, I'll quit asking for it. Thanks. I chose to back out of that conversation so something like this wouldn't happen. Somebody who actually uses Barnes bullets will be able to validate they loose weight to some degree. I could care less either way. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: SWThomas And based on things I've heard from people who have associated with Grouse, he's full of it. And all of the accusations I have made are pretty much right on. But if you like BS, that cool I guess..... I gotta plan SWThomas, maybe we should see who's full of it. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: Powerfisher I agree. I remember when I got into BP. I was on another site posting on their forum. I got ruffed up a bit. Being so green and not so bright I felt like a target. I believe it was Lee or Bronko who recomended this site to me. Untill this particular thread was posted, everybody seemed to be here to learn and teach. There are a lot of opinions here. There are a few cyber bullies on this site but it hasnt gone too far untill now. Some of the folks here are very opinionated and others listen, teach and learn. Nobody knows it all. Burntmuch, I wont cast my vote on you either. You are welcome on my island any time. SW, you jumped my post cuz I made an error and still havent told me what was wrong with it. Was it the mis-quote that I posted or was it the copper fouling in the barrel? All you said was, "QUOTE" "Yeah, it was posted by lemoyne. And it's wrong." What was wrong? That kinda rubbed me the wrong way. Quick to criticize. How about offering some constructive criticism and helping out the guys like me that are new to the obsession of MLing. Perhaps its not your fault. Perhaps you are pre-menopausal or in full stage. Who knows. But I agree with burntmuch, lighten up. This forum is for teaching, learning and sharing experiences, not bullying folks around. Grouse45 may have his opinions and some facts. I may not agree with him, but im not bashing him either. Have fun with this one, just my $.02 |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: Grouse45 ORIGINAL: SWThomas Okay. If you were just talking out of your arse and don't have any evidence to prove your claim, I'll quit asking for it. Thanks. I chose to back out of that conversation so something like this wouldn't happen. Somebody who actually uses Barnes bullets will be able to validate they loose weight to some degree. I could care less either way. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: Grouse45 ORIGINAL: SWThomas And based on things I've heard from people who have associated with Grouse, he's full of it. And all of the accusations I have made are pretty much right on. But if you like BS, that cool I guess..... I gotta plan SWThomas, maybe we should see who's full of it. What's this plan you speak of. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Oh, cut it out you two. I've seen tired two year olds that behaved better.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spaniel
Now I'm a relative young'un here so go easy on me if my understanding of history is off, but it is my understanding that the Partition is a relatively old design that was revolutionary in its time because of its ability to hold the bulk of the bullet together as bonded bullets had not really been introduced (or at least perfected) yet. At least that's always been my understanding of how things came about...I was probably 8 or 9 when I read this explanation so I may be wrong. This might/maybe be a good example... Here is a factory picture of an expanded perfectly mushroomed bonded 300 grain Gold Dot  Yet in real life the bonded bullet does not offer a structure in the bullet that will hold the bullet from distorting. So when you recover them from real life shooting they go askew but the lead is bonded to the copper and weight loss is minimal.  It is also my contention that this skewing will also alter the flight path of the bullet as it passes through an animal - not that it is a huge problem. but i THINK I would like a bullet that will stay the course of the shot all the way through... I think the uniformity of this expansion offers a better chance of this happening.  Hopefully changing the mood of this thread a bit... |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Most bullets that penatrate well are lost out the far side of game, I had to spend some time with a metal detector getting this one back and it was shot out of a high tree stand it went through a 6 point and 4 inches [ approx]into the ground. Lee
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
lemoyne
Ya by golly! that is what i expect to see from a lead copper bullet that works well. And since the lead is bonded it probably did not loose excess weight. Can you get a picture of the remaining shank? Since I see that is it a Gold Dot and I can see that it has expaanded to the dot - I am sure there remains a bullet shank that carries weight... + the weight of the exanded portion... I still firmly believe it is a 'poor man's' Nosler... |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
All this is why I want to gear up Nosler's for my X7 for my elk trip, though I still haven't decided if I want to hump 2 guns plus a sidearm 8+ miles into the back country. I probably won't take the ML unless we contract horses to dump off a camp and lighten the pack I need to carry in. There aren't a ton of elk back there and we're hunting late season so given the ordeal involved I can't justify not taking the centerfire.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spaniel
There aren't a ton of elk back there and we're hunting late season so given the ordeal involved I can't justify not taking the centerfire. If you do not take it... well you know And with the expense of the trip - you really need to be best prepared for most of the possible encounters... |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: sabotloader spaniel There aren't a ton of elk back there and we're hunting late season so given the ordeal involved I can't justify not taking the centerfire. If you do not take it... well you know And with the expense of the trip - you really need to be best prepared for most of the possible encounters... |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spaniel
Wel shoot! if you guys a willing to tag team that is the way to handle it - if you can decide how you are going to handle the situation when it arises... I have tried get Terry to come with me an carry my rifle for me... so far hasn't gone over real well.. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Spaniel,
A ton of gear to buy??????? Isn't he already a hunter? Can you explain a little. I never have been elk hunting. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Grouse45
I am thinking they are planning a backpack hunting trip. Everything they need will need to be carried in on their backs. that will take some special equipment you might not normally have.... just thinking.. Think spaniel said it was an eight mile walk one-way. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: Grouse45 Spaniel, A ton of gear to buy??????? Isn't he already a hunter? Can you explain a little. I never have been elk hunting. I've never walked 8 miles in a day deer hunting, going after elk we were covering 16-18/day for 4 days. $270 boots were worth every penny. I have found that all the good quality gear I bought for Montana last year is "nice to have" and makes deer hunting in Indiana more enjoyable, but I certainly wouldn't have spend the money for it if I didn't NEED it for out west. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
I get it now, thanks. Have you ever heard of Rivers West hunting clothing? It's not real exspensive but pretty good.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spanial you re right. Ive done Colorado elk hunts a few times. dawn to dusk walking the miles & blisters add up fast. Nothing like it though. Something we did, bot sure if it will work for you. We had big packs 70 lbs or so ,then day packs. We walked down an old logging road 6 or 7 miles, then a mile or so thru the brush. What we did was strapped the big packs onto a golfers wheeled cart. & pulled it down the road It saved our backs a bit
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
rivers west is ok. I own about $1000 worth of their stuff and i have a $275 jacket of theirs in my closet with #2 broken zipper. I love the pants but they make them for short fat boys. Large doesnt fit a 6'3 pollock very well.
Still pissed off about the jacket and it breaking 2 zippers [:@] I'll take my blanket capote as its warmer |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
Aren't they lifetime warranty?
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
no, they have a 10 year waterproof warranty.
I'll just take it into town and have the shop put a good zipper on it. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
My zipper seems okay. Thanks for the heads up.
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RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
ORIGINAL: burntmuch spanial you re right. Ive done Colorado elk hunts a few times. dawn to dusk walking the miles & blisters add up fast. Nothing like it though. Something we did, bot sure if it will work for you. We had big packs 70 lbs or so ,then day packs. We walked down an old logging road 6 or 7 miles, then a mile or so thru the brush. What we did was strapped the big packs onto a golfers wheeled cart. & pulled it down the road It saved our backs a bit I'm ok with the 70lb pack, I just got sick of lugging it EVERYWHERE when we were hunting. We spent more time hiking than hunting. And carrying everything all the time, when I actually did shoot something I had to climb back over the mountain with about 100lbs on my back, plus a heavy-barreled rifle. My pack is a Cabela's Gun and Bow, it comes with a small detachable day pack that I stuff with everything I'd need if I needed to chase a critter (plus survival stuff). That way I can (and did) drop the main pack with a GPS waypoint and take off with just a few pounds on my back. |
RE: What are fragmenting bullets to you?
spaniel
Don't forget they have those alaskan man sleds you load your equipment into and then they drag behind as you walk - that will get a lot of equipment in and out of the camp. Basically used on snow but it would be easy to fashion one from Teflon with a man harness on your shoulders... |
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