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RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
Thanks for all the comments!
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RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
I'm going to put up another vote for the Savage 10ML-II. Smokeless muzzleloading is legal during all Iowa seasons, and once you try smokeless powder, you won't ever want to go back. Get yourself a Savage, some Barnes 300 grain Expander-MZ bullets, some Accurate Arms 5744 powder and a set of Lee Dipper powder measures. The 3.4cc dipper will give you 45 grains of 5744, which will push the 300 grain Barnes at roughly 2000 fps, and is very accurate. There is no smoke, no smell, the powder doesn't cost a fortune for a very small amount of powder like Blackhorn 209 and such (the pseudo-smokeless black powder powder substitutes are a rip-off by comparison). No swabbing, no need to clean immediately, no crud rings or seized breech plugs, no gunned up actions from blowback.
Savage offers a thumbhole version of the 10ML-II as well. I have the stainless/laminate version, and I absolutely love my rifle. I'll never go back to burning non-nitrocellulose based propellents unless the morons in the government force me to. It allows all the fun of muzzleloading, without the extreme cost of pseudo-smokeless powder like BH209 or the hassles of BP and most substitutes. Mike  |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
Nice piece!
The Savages are well spoken for on this and other forums but it seems from all I read that the large majority of ML shooters prefer the "pseudos" or BP. |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
The reason I say pseudo-smokeless is because they keep making new powders that creep closer and closer to the properties of nitrocellulose based smokeless powder, without quite getting there. If you look at Blackhorn 209, it has almost all of the properties of nitro smokeless, but it is still "acceptable" to those who pay lip service to a more traditionalist approach to muzzleloading. Many of these folks vehemently argue against smokeless powder muzzleloading as being unsafe (it's not if the rifle is designed for it), or somehow unsportsmanlike because they think it gives some magical advantage in performance (it doesn't), but will pour copious amounts of insanely overpriced Blackhorn 209 into their muzzleloader without a second thought.
My reason for going with the Savage smokeless route is because it performs the same as "magnum" muzzleloaders, it's clean, it doesn't stink, I can sight in and then leave the barrel "as is" for the season, and I don't have to rush home to beat the rust that many BP substitutes will cause. It's also a MUCH cheaper ML to shoot. BH209 costs about $32 for a 10 ounce container. I buy AA-5744 for $19 for a full pound (16 oz). A 100 grain (by volume) load of BH209 weighs 66.8 grains and typically produces about 1800fps with a 300 grain bullet. A 120 grain (by volume) charge of BH209 weights about 80.2 grains and yields just under 2100fps. A 45 grain (by weight) charge of 5744 gives just over 2000fps. 10 ounces is equal to 4,375 grains. 4,375 / 80 grains per shot = 54 shots per bottle. $32/54 = $0.59/shot with BH 209. My Savage burns 45 grains of 5744 per shot. 7000 (grains/lb) / 45 = 155 shots/lb. $19 / 155 = $0.12/shot. That's 1/5 the cost per shot for powder, which is a substantial savings. Mike |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
ORIGINAL: driftrider The reason I say pseudo-smokeless is because they keep making new powders that creep closer and closer to the properties of nitrocellulose based smokeless powder, without quite getting there. If you look at Blackhorn 209, it has almost all of the properties of nitro smokeless, but it is still "acceptable" to those who pay lip service to a more traditionalist approach to muzzleloading. Many of these folks vehemently argue against smokeless powder muzzleloading as being unsafe (it's not if the rifle is designed for it), or somehow unsportsmanlike because they think it gives some magical advantage in performance (it doesn't), but will pour copious amounts of insanely overpriced Blackhorn 209 into their muzzleloader without a second thought. My reason for going with the Savage smokeless route is because it performs the same as "magnum" muzzleloaders, it's clean, it doesn't stink, I can sight in and then leave the barrel "as is" for the season, and I don't have to rush home to beat the rust that many BP substitutes will cause. It's also a MUCH cheaper ML to shoot. BH209 costs about $32 for a 10 ounce container. I buy AA-5744 for $19 for a full pound (16 oz). A 100 grain (by volume) load of BH209 weighs 66.8 grains and typically produces about 1800fps with a 300 grain bullet. A 120 grain (by volume) charge of BH209 weights about 80.2 grains and yields just under 2100fps. A 45 grain (by weight) charge of 5744 gives just over 2000fps. 10 ounces is equal to 4,375 grains. 4,375 / 80 grains per shot = 54 shots per bottle. $32/54 = $0.59/shot with BH 209. My Savage burns 45 grains of 5744 per shot. 7000 (grains/lb) / 45 = 155 shots/lb. $19 / 155 = $0.12/shot. That's 1/5 the cost per shot for powder, which is a substantial savings. Mike Mike, You have a point. A good point. I'm one of those that shoots BH209 and yes I agree it is probably closer to smokeless than BP. So...if you shoot 209 you may as well just shoot smokeless if what your looking for is convenience (clean up, swabbing etc). I like the Savage (and just about all other hunting weapons). They all serve a purpose. I guess the question to one looking for advice would be to ask what do you want to accomplish? And how do you want to accomplish it (in a traditional fashion or a more modern fashion)? |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
I just bought a CVA ACCURA- Any help with finding Realtree camo Weaver or warne bases would be helpfull. I got the rings ordered.
Also If you have a CVA ACCURA with a Nikon Omega scope what bullet are you shooting and how accurate? (thanks to all with replys) |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
I would suggest you get this base http://www.eabco.com/cgi-bin/shopper...on&key=127-814 in spite of it not being camo finished. That base should give you maximum mounting flexibility.
Did you order Warne rings? |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
I ordered warne rings. Now I I been looking at these durasights? http://durasight.com/z2_alloy/mount_systems.html
What do you think about them? |
RE: Which Muzzleloader too buy??
ORIGINAL: IOWAWHITETAILS I ordered warne rings. Now I I been looking at these durasights? http://durasight.com/z2_alloy/mount_systems.html What do you think about them? Dave |
RE: CVA ACCURA SHOOTERS
For the Price and what you get I'd buy a CVA ACCURA, you cant beat all you get for what you pay. I have 2 and love em both.
Have you tried a (thumbhole stock) yet? Most people I talked to and even myself have thought a thumbhole stock was it, but when I tried one I did'nt like it. But if that's what you want get a ACCURA with the thumbhole stock and Im sure you'll be glad you did. Cabela's has em now at a great price. (BP) |
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