RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I'm not trying to take away from your gun, I think they are an awsome gun, but the fact is just because the bullet goes in from the muzzle doesn't make it a muzzleloader. I'm with cayugad I like the limits that are on ML guns for ML seasons. Like I said earlier your gun is COOL and in the near futire I'll have one, I have seen them on tv and have watched your video on the web, and want one bad, but don't think it should be used in a ML legal seaon.

Again this is just my opinion and ya know what they say, just like that famous hole everyone has one!

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I DONT HAVE ONE, I just saw the show where one was used. I tooDO NOTthink they should be legal to use during ML Season. Nor do I think Cross-Bows should be used during Archery Seasons,or at all period, My OP,,,,UNLESS your Handicapped. Traditional should stay Traditional. It's all about learning to get close to the game we hunt and mastering the skills involved in the weapon we hunt with. BP

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I with you on that, I to am a bow hunter, I do use a compound with a fiberoptic sight and that is because I SUCK with a traditional bow. My some is special need and he hunts with a crossbow, but he is wanting to start ML hunting with a traditional gun

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I do have a (recurve) Bow, but it's just for fooling around, Im sure I could harvest a Deer with it, but I would'nt take a shot any further than 20yds with it. And there's nothing wrong with fiber-optic sights on Compounds, everyone uses them, anything that can help us make the best shot possible on a animal is good for everyone, and especially the animal. My Best to your Son, I hope he enjoys the sport, and has a Blast Muzzleloading! BP

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

The performance advantage of smokeless is one thing, the inline vs sidehammer argument is borderline ridiculous. It's primarily cosmetic. My old sidelock shot well to 200 yds. If you want strong performance restrictions, keep out smokeless and scopes. Once you allow scopes, any standard ML with commonly accepted bullets and decidedly standard charges, regardless of what the gun looks like, is a 300+ yd gun in the right hands.

You guys got to remember that the goal of ML season differs greatly by state too. Out west, I can see the emphasis on an opportunity for a more traditional hunt. In southern Michigan and, to a lesser extent Indiana, it is an important additional population control season where you need more people afield not less. This year my buddies back where I grew up said they went so far as to extend regular firearms seasons -- at the expense of bow and ML hunters -- to get more does taken.

I don't know about you but I'd rather see more guys in the field with me with scoped inlines than shotguns....

I am not going to pay the outlandish prices for these guns, switching to smokeless, for some reason, is the point at which I stop seeing the point in it. I don't know why, it's as arbitrary as any of the other lines people draw to define these guns (which are all arbitrary opinions by the way). I have one ML with a scope that I shoot long range, and TWO with open sights. I rarely get out during ML-only seasons, so the long range gun is used primarily during firearms opener. Come to think of it, I think the rare occasions I get out and take deer during ML-only season I've always used one of the open sight guns...

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I like your thinking, I use only ML's for Hunting, shotgun season too. Back to scoped ML's, our state allows scoped ML's for Muzz. Season, the reason is you get LESS WOUNDED DEER with a scope then with open-sights. If more guy's would switch to ML's during ShotGunn Season it would make them better hunters and there would be less wounded Deer knowing that you only have 1 shot and you better make it a good one or pass. BP

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I can see your piont on thining the herd and also agree with what you are saying. Out west we have no need to cull deer or elk so I don't mind the limits put on ML's. When needed to cull I would like to see more ML seasons than shotgun myself. That said I to draw the line at smokeless or smoke powder

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

Smokeless was the first and still is the original black powder substitute. Any rifle loaded from the muzzle is a muzzle loader IMHO. Please check your bottles of so called black powder substitute. they are all clasified as smokless powder. IMHO your arguments are that smokeless shouldn't be used holds no water unless you will and only will use true Black Powder.

Ken
Central NY

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

!00 to 140gr of imr 4350. Wow thats one heck of a load. Even with my 300 mag if I use 4350 I use less than 80grs. That has got to have a ton of recoil.

RE: BadBull Muzzleloaders
 

I don't think anyone said smokeless shouldn't be used Screwbolts, only that it was not something they were interested in. We have a number of Savage/smokeless shooters on the forum who enjoy "going both ways", and we still talk to them. :D