American Pioneer Sticks
 

I am thinking of trying out the American Pioneer sticks this year. Have any of yall tried these? Kind of expensive to get on a whim without any real world reviews. I have tried the pyrodex and the 777 and prefer the pyrodex of the two but thinkin of doin something different this year.

Thanks
Kelly

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

Of all the pellets you will shoot, the APP are the lowest in velocity. They will be the cleanest of the pellets, but personally I would not bother with them. I am a loose powder shooter for the most part.

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

I agree with Cayuqad stay loose and never look back.

;)WV Mountaineer

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

I was at the range today. (w/my .22s), on my way out a guy was shooting his new triumph w/t7 loose. Said he had been shooting stck powder. It was grouping 4-6 ins. he went to using loose and his groups shrunk to 1 inch! said the triumph was the best shooting, easiest cleaning mz he ever saw!!

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

I shot APP for 2 years, you have to keep dehydrateing the stuff or it becomes eratic and shoots all over the place.
I would recommend Pyrodex for traditional guns and open action inlines for good closed action inlines I would recommend Black Horn 209. Lee

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

I will agree STAY with the Loose Powder !
And any thing but AP :)

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

Thanks for the info. Looks like I will be sticking with the pyrodex.

Kelly

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

APP loose is clean shooting powder, the down side of it is that it picks up moisture quick and it has a large deviation (200 fps) with the same volume. The sticks are even worse, varying by up to 5 grains for 100g sticks. Your better off shooting loose if you wanna shoot APP, and your better off with 3f, since the 2f clumps so bad (with moisture) that it is hard to get accurate loads. Of all the powders, this was the slowest at 100g. My recommendation is not to use it, but if you must, go loose and go 3f. You may wanna try Blackhorn 209, it is accurate and less prone to water absorption problems.
Just some thought for you to consider. I love how it shoots clean, and Blackhorn does that also.
Chap Gleason

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

APP sticks and JSG sticks are not the way to go. JSGgranular 2F and 3Fare good powders. JSG likes a very tight fitting sabot that is seated really hard. Goex Pinnacle is made by the same company that makes APP and JSG. Pinnacle is much stronger than either APP or JSG and that is what my Encore is presently tuned for. Pinnacle 3F is not far off granular Pyrodex when it comes to power.The standard deviation is also about the same as Pyrodex.

RE: American Pioneer Sticks
 

I started out with these because I thought that my gun would clean better. It mabye did, but I ended up switching quickly. The "pellets" are not a uniform size by any means. Some are just little slivers in the can and others are a very hard rectangle like they are supposed to be. You never really know how many grains you are shooting because they are so irregular in shape. Use T7 powder and use two more swabs per shot.

So, my opinion is going to be different than many on here but here goes.
I went to the range yesterday with my 50 cal Model 700ML with a Nikon scope. I used the APP sticks (2 sticks per load should be 100 gr.), 295 grain hollow point powerbelts, and Winchester 209 primers.

My results were excellent. I could not be happier. I shot 4 groups of 3 shots at 75 yards. My first shot of the first group was a little high; about 5 inches. I am sure that was me. So, to remove any question on my inadequacies as a shooter, I used a really nice bench rest and my shots were incredible. Every shot taken after the first one was in a 1" - 1 1/4" group, dead on the bulls eye. I dont know about you all, but that is freakin spectacular for me! I have read horrible reviews about this powder and I have to question their tactics if their groups are that off. I have tried pyrodex and 777 and have had nearly the same results in accuracy, no complaints there, but that stuff (both the pdex and 777) are just filthy!! could only shoot twice, the third one would just click. the 777 was worse than the pdex in my experience.
I wound up shooting my ML 13 times yesterday. Every shot was excellent, and the greatest thing to me, was that I never cleaned it until I got home. I shot all 13 times right in a row without cleaning it! try doing that with pdex or 777... I know a guy needs to find the right combination for his ML and stick with it, and I definitley have. So, I dont understand all the negative press about APP. With my set up, it worked flawlessly, had very good groups, and was way cleaner than the rest.
And yesterday it was raining all day long here in MO. So I didnt not even have optimum conditions for shooting. I think you need to give this stuff a try, I love it!

I have never used the APP sticks.
I have used the pyrodex pelletts,I got them on clearence,I have 4 box's of them

The ONLY time I use compressed or pelletized powder is when I take my daughters or youth's to shoot for the first time I use 1 50 grn pellett so they can get used to it.Thats the only reason I keep them

I came to this forum shooting pelletts,The great folks here got me to try loose powder.That's all I shoot now is loose.

If sticks or pelletts are working for you,great.
But give loose a try also,don't close your mind to it.

I'm using black mag 3 this year. Is it in the same chemical makeup as pioneer as far as absorbing moisture.It shot great in my mk85 this summer when sighting it in. How do you dehydrate moist powder?

Deer 655
I suspect there are many ways; the one I use was to put it right next to the dehumidifier in the gun safe, in a few days it would start grouping again. But nothing helps the fact that it is the weakest powder we know of, and if it sucks up some moisture on a hunting trip you better have a sealed can handy. Lee

My experience with APP loose was less than satisfying but I see others doing really well with it. I bought that powder at the same place I buy blackpowder. When I went back for more blackpowder the shop owner told me that if I removed the grease from my conicals that it would work. So I tried that. I had the same problem. Erratic burn. So were duds which didn't much report and chrono readings which were subsonic confirmed why they didn't report loudly.

At the time I was shooting a NEF sidekick. I think part of my problem was that it didn't blow alot a flame into it. It was a new jug and it isn't humid here so I can't blame it on humidity. Also I had stocked up on Rem and Win Muzzleloading 209 which are weaker (when they were going for $1 a box at Walmart). I have yet to try it in my Apex or Kodiak Pro. Maybe I should try it in them. But I am so fond of blackpowder for its consistency I just haven't reopened the the jug.

Has anyone other than I noticed that Jim Schocky no longer talks about American Pioneer on his hunting program. I wonder what powder he is using now. I did watch a show of his filmed in Africa and right on camera it showed flaming pellets being ejected from the bore when he shot. He turned to his PH with a stunned look on his face as the PH asked him, What the &^*l was that?

While it works good fresh out of a new can I found it unreliable, after a while and had to keep it dehumidified. I could not even give it away around here so it end up being flushed. Lee

By always keeping the lid/seal on the can tight....WITH extra Desiccant/Silica gel packs in the can. You should do this with all powder--even smokeless powder included:s1::cool2:

These are very inexpensive and work great!!!



This will ensure bone dry powder every time. You should also store your loads in air-tite/waterproof tubes or speed loaders for the range or hunting.

Folks, honestly, there is no reason/excuse for damp/moisture contaminated powder anymore....:patriot: