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just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Well last week my dad and I finally decided to get a couple of rifles. Since kansas just changed some of their regulations we might get to gun hunt this year if we dont succed with our bows. I think we got a smokin deal on a couple of optima elites in stainless steal with a .50 cal/.270 combo for right at about $800. So next weekend is going to be our first time to the rifle range, I know that there is alot that goes into hunting with a muzzle loader and just shooting them also. Ive been reading up on the basics, but if you've got any advice for a newb I'd sure appreciate it. Thanks, I just can't wait to get out and go get some shooting in.
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RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
have fun;)
start with a small load to get use to it. if you are using pellets, try 100grains. If powder, then start with90-100grains. After you get use to it, then step up to the big loads if you want but 90-100grains will do the job out to 100yards easy:) I like 100grains of triple 7 pellets, but recently I just switched to the blackhorn 209 powder and a 115grain load. Grab some different sabots to try. I like shockwaves but I hear SST and many others do the job also. Barnes makes some very good loads also. Goodluck again and happy shooting.. remember the more you shoot, the better feel you get for your Ml'er. Also, try some freehand shots without a rest after you get it sighted in because 50% of the time you may not have a solid rest to shoot from in the real world after you are done, take the time to break down and clean the gun. Some people slack on that part and wonder where missfires and etc come from. |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Optima Elites are good rifles from all I have read. I am sure they will serve you well. Since it is a .50 caliber, first thing you need to consider is what legal projectiles are in your State, and what kind of ranges are you expecting to encounter. Also if scopes are legal or not. From there choose a projectile that will get the job done as efficient as possible. Also check into whether Black Horn 209 powder is legal and if you can get your hands on any. That is a great powder and with a good hot primer should shoot real well in your rifles.
There are lots of other things you will need. Cappers and de-cappers. Primers, loading jags, short starters, brushes, solvent, oil, breech plug grease, just to name a few. Get a good powder measure with a see through design with a cut off funnel. And if you can not get Black Horn, try some Pyrodex RS or Triple Se7en 2f. You might want to pick up some 250 grain Shockwaves, 300 grain XTPs and some different sabots... But the first thing you need to do is clean your rifle. Learn all the parts of the rifle. And read your manual and know it inside and out.. good luck with your rifles. |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
My advice to youis to sell everything you have to me for a fraction of what you paid for it, run away as fast as you can and consider yourself lucky.
This is the advice I was givin when I made the same post,I did not listen and now I am hooked. I will leave the bullett and load advice to shooters with much more knowldge than I but I will say welcome to the sickness |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Sweet:D
I'd say, strip them down and clean them till they are squeeky clean, with solvents and or warm soapy (Dawn) water;) And have at it[8D] One word of safety...Always keep your head in the game. It's easy to get distracted when shooting with friends and family. So make sure you mark your ramrods for the Empty Barrel postion(Witness Marks) and the Loaded postions so you can check your rifles at any stage in the loading procedure. If you are in any doubt about your load...STOP, remove the breech plug, and push the whole load out the rear of the barrel and clean up, and start over;) Let's all go home in one piece..Amen?:D |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Great advice Lane
Amen:D |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
I learned my first year hunting....
--Keep ALL your ML stuff in one bag together! --Buy 2 boxes of the same primers and put one box in your vehicle. Have you ever forgotten your release for your bow? :( --Buy some speed load tubes. That is how I keep track of what goes in the barrel in the dark morning when I am excited.:) --Shoot enough to gain some confidence in you new ML. It is a wonderful sport! |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
pheasantHUNTER121 ORIGINAL: MoNoFletch I learned my first year hunting.... --Keep ALL your ML stuff in one bag together! --Buy 2 boxes of the same primers and put one box in your vehicle. Have you ever forgotten your release for your bow? :( --Buy some speed load tubes. That is how I keep track of what goes in the barrel in the dark morning when I am excited.:) --Shoot enough to gain some confidence in you new ML. It is a wonderful sport! Duh... What was I thinking[8D] pheasantHUNTER121 Get me your address and I'll get some Powder Tubes out to ya ASAP;) |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
LN'
Check your PM's!! |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Remember...
Powder first, bullet second!!! Remove Ramrod!!! Swab between shots with a DAMP (not wet) patch... NO Smokeless powder!!! And finally...You are basically making a pipe bomb...So be careful!!! |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
ORIGINAL: nchawkeye Remember... Powder first, bullet second!!! Remove Ramrod!!! Swab between shots with a DAMP (not wet) patch... NO Smokeless powder!!! And finally...You are basically making a pipe bomb...So be careful!!! |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
ORIGINAL: LaneNebraska Sweet:D I'd say, strip them down and clean them till they are squeeky clean, with solvents and or warm soapy (Dawn) water;) And have at it[8D] One word of safety...Always keep your head in the game. It's easy to get distracted when shooting with friends and family. So make sure you mark your ramrods for the Empty Barrel postion(Witness Marks) and the Loaded postions so you can check your rifles at any stage in the loading procedure. If you are in any doubt about your load...STOP, remove the breech plug, and push the whole load out the rear of the barrel and clean up, and start over;) Let's all go home in one piece..Amen?:D |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
You have been given great advice and direction from the others.I might add that I have JB'd all my rifles befor ever shooting and found out that I have 3 good shooting mzlrs.and many centerfires.I'm pretty convinced that all those guns are not factory sent shooters.In my mzlers.,two Omegas and one Krb7, I also found that I have zero problem with the devil sent
'crud ring".I feel by doing the JB compound I have cured two problems lots of folks experience.Less than acceptable accuracy and crud rings.Just my 2 cents and experience.Good luck,..you're gonna have fun. hunt4me |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Consistency! Just make sure everything you do is consistent from shot to shot. Clean the same way, load the same way, use the same pressure, etc… This way when you start making small adjustments, you know what variables are in the equation. Make one adjustment (bullet weight, charge, powder, cleaning, seating pressure, etc…) at a time and keep everything else consistent. This way you will be able to know exactly what effect a single change has on everything else and what it is actually doing to your point of impact. I always found it easier to try and get good groups with the rifle and solidify my load combination, before sighting in exactly.
Also, BEWARE, it is extremely addicting! Have fun. |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
One more thing. Either keep your targets with all load data annotated on them (powder charge, bullet, sabot, primer,distance, etc.) or get yourself a small note book and record all of that data plus group size. You'll be glad you did.
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RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
ORIGINAL: pheasantHUNTER121 Well last week my dad and I finally decided to get a couple of rifles. Since kansas just changed some of their regulations we might get to gun hunt this year if we dont succed with our bows. I think we got a smokin deal on a couple of optima elites in stainless steal with a .50 cal/.270 combo for right at about $800. So next weekend is going to be our first time to the rifle range, I know that there is alot that goes into hunting with a muzzle loader and just shooting them also. Ive been reading up on the basics, but if you've got any advice for a newb I'd sure appreciate it. Thanks, I just can't wait to get out and go get some shooting in. http://www.the-gleasons.com/Tips%20for%20Organizing%20Hunting%20Content.pdf If you wanna keep it simple shoot pellets, since they are easier. If you wanna shoot loose, shoot the new Blackhorn 209 and forget the swabing and all the other stuff that is a pain with 777. If your gonna shoot Powerbelts, I would use 1 50g pellet and 1 30g pellet, since they fragment if pushed too hard. You will have fun. Read the manual carefully, clean your rifle immediatly after each use with anything except Blackhorn 209. Go to http://www.chuckhawks.com/index2h.muzzleloader.htm and read the intro in the "GeneralMLing Information" Section. Ask questions on this forum when you need advice or have a question, we were all novices at one point in time, and we enjoy helping others. Best Wishes, Chap |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
ORIGINAL: pheasantHUNTER121 Since kansas just changed some of their regulations we might get to gun hunt this year if we dont succed with our bows. Then Chap said: I shot open sights the first year, recommend you do the same, since getting an excellent quality scope is important and they areabout$200. The Wildlife and Parks Commission approves the addition for the early season. BY MICHAEL PEARCE The Wichita Eagle For the first time, Kansas deer hunters will be allowed to hunt with scopes on their muzzleloaders during the state's early muzzleloader season. Wildlife and Parks commissioners voted 4-3 to allow scopes of any magnification after more than 20 minutes of discussion during a meeting Thursday night in Topeka. Commissioner Frank Meyer of Herington was against the regulation, saying, "with these new muzzleloaders all you're doing is extending the regular firearms deer season by two weeks." Commissioner Gerald Lauber of Topeka supported allowing scopes to make it easier for hunters with vision problems to aim their rifles and place their shots more accurately. Chris Tymeson, Wildlife and Parks attorney, said complaints have been filed with the federal government claiming that denying the use of scopes discriminates against hunters with poor sight. Commissioners were unanimous in passing the following equipment-related regulations for deer hunting: • Allowing the use of knapped stone broadheads for bowhunting. • Allowing the use of hard-cast lead bullets in muzzleloaders and rifles. • Allowing the use of crossbows during the state's regular firearms season. The following regulations for over-the-counter permits also passed the commission: • The creation of a "three-in-one" state-wide whitetail permit, which allows residents to hunt across the state, in any season with the appropriate weapon. • The creation of a state-wide archery any deer/either species permit that allows a bowhunter to take whitetail or mule deer. The permit is only valid during archery season. • The issuance of muzzleloader any deer/either species permits that allows permit holders to hunt whitetail or mule deer in select western Kansas units. Such permits would not be valid during archery season and would require hunters to use a muzzleloader during the state's regular firearms deer season. I think that they should just buy a scope that works and meets their budget to enjoy the most accuracy that their rifles can provide toward havinga successful hunt and/or more enjoyable range sessions. There's no reason to hunt, shoot or range testwith open sights unnecessarily. Many parents and adultsthink that their young children should take their first shots using a .22 with open sights too. But believe it or not, the NRA First Steps Basic Rifle Course Handbook recommends just the opposite. They believe that a newbie child's first shots should be taken with a scoped .22 so that they can hit their target moreand have a more successful and rewarding 1st shooting experience. Nothing will turn off a child more than not being able to hit the target that they were aiming at, especially if they're shooting at longer hunting distances. What one person might consider to be more of ahuntingchallenge, another might consider to be a handicap which can ruintheir entire hunting tripor shooting experience. There's plenty of time for kids to learn how to shoot with open sights. My oldest son shot in smallbore competition withpeep sights startingwhenhe was a young child. But when he shot withadultsin light rifle competitionwhere using a scope was allowed, or when he was first learning and practicinghow to shoot a rifle safely, or when he was plinking atsoda cansat 70 yards, he certainly enjoyedshooting witha "cheap"scope. Since the Kansas rules were changed, why not take advantage of them even if the scope doesn't cost $200? I don'trequire a $200 scope to enjoy shooting a rifle even if onlysemi-accurately. Sometimes the scope that fits the riflethebest or suits the shooter's tastedoesn't cost anywherenear$200, and yet they actually do work as intended. I guess I've said too muchalreadybut Idid submit apost! :) ;):D  |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
There are many quality scopes out there that get the job done for under $100.00 . Now granted they are not a top of the line Nikon, Burris, or Leupold or some such, but I have a Bushnell Banner that costed $69.00 and you'd think you're shooting a much more expensive scope then that.. Although I do like the Bushnell 3200, Nikon Pro Staff, and some others better then the Banner, it still works good, shoots straight, and does what a scope is meant to do.
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RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
Thanks guys! I sure couldn't ask for any better responses, which makes me glad to know that the muzzle-loading community sure seems to care. Ive got it all planned out for this weekends trip to the range, I think we many be going with a friend of my dads whos had muzzle loader experience before. The one thing I will try is to shoot with open-sights atleast on my muzzle-loader I will be primarily hunting with it in the whitetail woods out of my stand where the farthest shot would be 80 yds at most. Who knows we'll see how I shoot at the range and if I dont feel confident I'll just stick to my bow, but this looks to be a new one of my many addicting hobbies:D
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RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
With a muzzle loader you must find the right load for your rifle first. That is as important as putting rounds through it. I'd try and find out what the suggested load is. Load in muzzle loaders includes both the amount of powder & type of projectile (solid lead, Saboted round etc).Each rifle may shoot differently with differentprojectile weights and powder charges. Yours I believe is an inline like mine. So it is probaby made to shoot sabotted rounds. Rifle twist also greatly affects accuracy. The tighter twists (24, 26, 38) favor sabboted rounds, looser twists favor all lead projectiles. If you can get a standard load for your rifle you can go from there. Also may want to pay attention to the propellant you use. There are several on the market. I prefer 777 in the double F myself but that seems to work in my old TC Thunderhawk quite well. I do have a TC Black Diamond but have failed so far to find a good load for it. So finding a load can be frustrating at times. The earlier you start the better. Hope this helps.
Steve |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
ORIGINAL: arcticap ORIGINAL: pheasantHUNTER121 Since kansas just changed some of their regulations we might get to gun hunt this year if we dont succed with our bows. Then Chap said: I shot open sights the first year, recommend you do the same, since getting an excellent quality scope is important and they areabout$200. The Wildlife and Parks Commission approves the addition for the early season. BY MICHAEL PEARCE The Wichita Eagle For the first time, Kansas deer hunters will be allowed to hunt with scopes on their muzzleloaders during the state's early muzzleloader season. Wildlife and Parks commissioners voted 4-3 to allow scopes of any magnification after more than 20 minutes of discussion during a meeting Thursday night in Topeka. Commissioner Frank Meyer of Herington was against the regulation, saying, "with these new muzzleloaders all you're doing is extending the regular firearms deer season by two weeks." Commissioner Gerald Lauber of Topeka supported allowing scopes to make it easier for hunters with vision problems to aim their rifles and place their shots more accurately. Chris Tymeson, Wildlife and Parks attorney, said complaints have been filed with the federal government claiming that denying the use of scopes discriminates against hunters with poor sight. Commissioners were unanimous in passing the following equipment-related regulations for deer hunting: • Allowing the use of knapped stone broadheads for bowhunting. • Allowing the use of hard-cast lead bullets in muzzleloaders and rifles. • Allowing the use of crossbows during the state's regular firearms season. The following regulations for over-the-counter permits also passed the commission: • The creation of a "three-in-one" state-wide whitetail permit, which allows residents to hunt across the state, in any season with the appropriate weapon. • The creation of a state-wide archery any deer/either species permit that allows a bowhunter to take whitetail or mule deer. The permit is only valid during archery season. • The issuance of muzzleloader any deer/either species permits that allows permit holders to hunt whitetail or mule deer in select western Kansas units. Such permits would not be valid during archery season and would require hunters to use a muzzleloader during the state's regular firearms deer season. I think that they should just buy a scope that works and meets their budget to enjoy the most accuracy that their rifles can provide toward havinga successful hunt and/or more enjoyable range sessions. There's no reason to hunt, shoot or range testwith open sights unnecessarily. Many parents and adultsthink that their young children should take their first shots using a .22 with open sights too. But believe it or not, the NRA First Steps Basic Rifle Course Handbook recommends just the opposite. They believe that a newbie child's first shots should be taken with a scoped .22 so that they can hit their target moreand have a more successful and rewarding 1st shooting experience. Nothing will turn off a child more than not being able to hit the target that they were aiming at, especially if they're shooting at longer hunting distances. What one person might consider to be more of ahuntingchallenge, another might consider to be a handicap which can ruintheir entire hunting tripor shooting experience. There's plenty of time for kids to learn how to shoot with open sights. My oldest son shot in smallbore competition withpeep sights startingwhenhe was a young child. But when he shot withadultsin light rifle competitionwhere using a scope was allowed, or when he was first learning and practicinghow to shoot a rifle safely, or when he was plinking atsoda cansat 70 yards, he certainly enjoyedshooting witha "cheap"scope. Since the Kansas rules were changed, why not take advantage of them even if the scope doesn't cost $200? I don'trequire a $200 scope to enjoy shooting a rifle even if onlysemi-accurately. Sometimes the scope that fits the riflethebest or suits the shooter's tastedoesn't cost anywherenear$200, and yet they actually do work as intended. I guess I've said too muchalreadybut Idid submit apost! :) ;):D
Chap |
RE: just got my first muzzleloader!!! any suggestions before I take it out?
I would also add if you are new to muzzleloaders get a friend or family member who knows aboutML'sto go with you to the range. It can be a little intimidating for a begginer till you get use to it. I remember the 1st few times i fired a muzzleloader was intimidating for me.
Of course all the stories my Cousins use to tell me about muzzys when i was starting out did not help either. |
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