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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman Chap,of all the savages that I have set up or helped set up he last 3 0r 4 years only a few of them shot better by swabbing between shots,wanted to mention it because the savage is like any other type of muzzleloader useing little tricks to get better accuracy.Most are useing the IMR4759 in different grains,one fellow is useing IMR4227 and won't change,he says he has killed deer out to 280yds with it and going to keep useing it.A couple are useing the 5744 and like it.One fellow was very hard headed and used the dippers to measure his 4759,and couldn't get it to shoot too good at 100 yds,he had a friend with him and he wasn't hard headed and listened,by the time we had his rifle set up he shot a 3shot one hole group,a week later the other fellow called me and said he that he had finally shot a one holer,I said you weighed your load didn't you and he addmitted that he did. Another thing that has helped my savage to shoot more constant is that I had my buddie to bed the recoil lug,I tightened the front screw and never touch it,unless I am going to strip it all the way down to do a good cleaning,to clean after range trip I just turn the back screw enough to get the bolt out. The only requirement if I am going to help anyone set up a savage is that they clean the barrel with JB bore cleaner with at least 200 strokes.This gives them a very clean barrel to start with and saves time in working up loads.. The mmp short sabot is a good choice with the xtp,below is a pic compareing a knight sabot to the mmp useing the xtp's. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Ok. Here is shooting with 44g of weighed 5744, 300g XTP, Federal Primer, MMP Shot Sabot, no swabing. The barrel stayed pretty cool, I put water on it on shot 6 and 8. Here is 50 yards first 3 shots. Chap
 And here is 92.5 range finder yards, the next 7 shots: |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Ok. Here is shooting this AMwith 44g of weighed AA 5744, 300g XTP bullet, Federal Primer, MMP Short blackSabot, no swabbing. The barrel stayed pretty cool, I put water on it on shot 6 and 8. Here is 50 yards first 3 shots.
And here is 92.5 range finder yards, the next 7 shots:  Which is realy good shooting for me--usually I am 3" at 100 yards with a Omega and Disc with a 3x9 Bushnell 3200 scope. So the "error of my ways" was not weighing the charge the first 30 shots I shot out of the gun. Now to try some other bullets, since I have the Hornady dialed inOK with the factory recommended charge. Shots4,5,6 were touching.1.5" vertical group and 1.5" horizontal group, maybe a 2" group overall, I would say I am shooting 1.5" high at 100 yards. I am impresssed with the Savage out of the box accuracy with the recommended load, bullet and sabot. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Looks like you doing really well,if I am looking at the squares right looks like you got 4 shots in one inch and 2 slightly out.
Now all you need is practice and you will be shooting some oneholers too. The 50 yd group looks like a tiny triangle,any time a rifle of any caliber shoots triangles of any size means that it has the potintal of being a shooter. Glad you are doing so good keep it up,if I can help in any way just let me know. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman Looks like you doing really well,if I am looking at the squares right looks like you got 4 shots in one inch and 2 slightly out. Now all you need is practice and you will be shooting some oneholers too. The 50 yd group looks like a tiny triangle,any time a rifle of any caliber shoots triangles of any size means that it has the potintal of being a shooter. Glad you are doing so good keep it up,if I can help in any way just let me know. Chap Gleason |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Hi Chap,
WOW... Just do not forget to check the hole in the ventliner: when = or > 0.035 inch change it. Have a good practice Herman, You are a great "10ml-II mentor" Etienne Brule. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Something to consider getting is the EZ Rachet breechplug tool, as it allows you to remove the breechplug without loosening the rear action screw, thus eliminating a possible move of POI due to shifting. I have never noticed a shift in my sav, but have one on order. You can get the info to order one, if interested on the link I post earlier to Dougs Message Board. They are a little spendy, at least I think so, at $43 and change, but seem like a very good thing to have if accuracy is especiallly important to you.
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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Etienne Brule Hi Chap, WOW... Just do not forget to check the hole in the ventliner: when = or > 0.035 inch change it. Have a good practice Herman, You are a great "10ml-II mentor" Etienne Brule. Vent Liner_Etienne_2007_06_01.pdf so I remember what was said and who said it. Just like doing a research paper and referencing something someone else said. Again, thanks so much for your help and your willing spirit. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Nice job Chap! Speaking of old dogs and new tricks!;)
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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion Something to consider getting is the EZ Rachet breechplug tool, as it allows you to remove the breechplug without loosening the rear action screw, thus eliminating a possible move of POI due to shifting. I have never noticed a shift in my sav, but have one on order. You can get the info to order one, if interested on the link I post earlier to Dougs Message Board. They are a little spendy, at least I think so, at $43 and change, but seem like a very good thing to have if accuracy is especiallly important to you. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: oldrookie Nice job Chap! Speaking of old dogs and new tricks!;) Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: gleason.chapman Etienne, ... for the .035 tip, I saw some pictures of ablown out one so I have that vividly in my mind. Where do youbuy the Vent liners? Ionly have 40 shots thru it, so it should take 100 right? The mini Drill Bit: Item: # 20PCDS - $9.95 per setMini Drill Bit Sets on http://www.sloanswoodshop.com/drill_bits.htm 100 ventliners: around that, with the kind of loads. Any way, you will notice that the change is quite sudden in a blu sky... in a few rounds, there it goes... I use to check the vent after every range session; or during the session if suddenly everything goes out of control... I mean not even shooting at the 2 x 2. Hope that will help. Etienne Brule. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: gleason.chapman ORIGINAL: Red Lion Something to consider getting is the EZ Rachet breechplug tool, as it allows you to remove the breechplug without loosening the rear action screw, thus eliminating a possible move of POI due to shifting. I have never noticed a shift in my sav, but have one on order. You can get the info to order one, if interested on the link I post earlier to Dougs Message Board. They are a little spendy, at least I think so, at $43 and change, but seem like a very good thing to have if accuracy is especiallly important to you. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion [ Don't worry about tightening the vent liner or breachplug to a specific ft/lbs. I have never worried, other than to have a good amount of nickel antiseize on the the threads for both and "snug" tight works. You should be able to get a good number of shots with 5744, say 50-70 before the vent liner starts to go. If you start using a hotter powder you will get less shots. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
50-70 shots before replacing the vent liner? How much do they cost?
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RE: Savage 10 ML
Thanks fellows but I would be the first to say I am no better than any of you,I just have many years of shooting experience and practice.I don't shoot any competion because I have no interests in it I just shoot to satisfy myself.If I can help someone that is great too.Believe it was 3 years ago I put over 1500 rounds of 250 gr sst's through 2 savage ML11.that year.
I was in town I think it was last year,at my age the years are like months and the months like days,they go so fast.A fellow comes up to me and asked if I remembered him?He looked familar but I couldn't remember where I had seen him.He said you set up my rifle for me and I killed 2 deer this past season.After talking to him he had been out west hunting and hunted here but had never scored on a deer.I think I was as happy for him as he was at getting his deer. I think RW has the best vent liners they really do last and last.Chap useing the 5744 load you should get at least 100 shots from the factory loads.I am taking for granted you have the vents with a single hole in them.The bits, etienne helped you out there,I put my drill bit in a t-handle that I picked up at a hardware store for a couple bucks,some even use a power drill. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: frontier gander 50-70 shots before replacing the vent liner? How much do they cost? 3:45Pm 6/1/07 Just called Savage and they sell them for $3 each, so I ordered 4. That should do me a year at 100 shots each. I also ordered a Savage Sling, Black to match the gun. Very nice looking: http://www.savagearms.com/shop/category.asp?catalog%5Fname=SavageArms&categor y%5Fname=Website+Promotions&Page=1 Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
You can also order the factory vent liners from Savage as well, with a phone call. It really depends on how much shooting that you plan to do....The RW vent liners perportedly last quite a bit longer, but again how much are you going to shoot? I have just stuck with the one hole factories, as I shoot maybe 50 rounds downrange all year.
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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion You can also order the factory vent liners from Savage as well, with a phone call. It really depends on how much shooting that you plan to do....The RW vent liners perportedly last quite a bit longer, but again how much are you going to shoot? I have just stuck with the one hole factories, as I shoot maybe 50 rounds downrange all year. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: gleason.chapman ORIGINAL: Red Lion You can also order the factory vent liners from Savage as well, with a phone call. It really depends on how much shooting that you plan to do....The RW vent liners perportedly last quite a bit longer, but again how much are you going to shoot? I have just stuck with the one hole factories, as I shoot maybe 50 rounds downrange all year. Chap http://randywakeman.com/ |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman My best load is the IMR4759 (47.5 grs) 250 sst or sw.and win primers.This is a stout load and gives 2440 fps.I think a lot of fellows use this powder and 42 0r 43 grs and the 250 and 300. Randy Wakeman says this about the4759, have you experienced this? Chap http://www.chuckhawks.com/ping_pong_balls.htm Hodgdon / IMR SR4759 If anything, a wee notch slower than Vihtavouri N110, SR4759 has generally good availability, its primary attribute, and is best used only for 250 grain bullets. About 42 grains is a reasonable charge, with a cautionary note. Poor Hodgdon / IMR quality control has resulted in up to 200 fps lot-to-lot variations. Several shooters like this powder, but if you change to a new can from a different lot, you had better bring your chronograph to the range with you. You may have to go down two full grains to eliminate sabot damage, or go up two full grains to get the same performance as before. The lot to lot consistency makes it not worth my time these days, particularly when hunting out of state. A new can of this stuff can be a brave new world. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion You can also order the factory vent liners from Savage as well, with a phone call. It really depends on how much shooting that you plan to do....The RW vent liners perportedly last quite a bit longer, but again how much are you going to shoot? I have just stuck with the one hole factories, as I shoot maybe 50 rounds downrange all year. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
If you really want the best advice regarding specifics for powders Dougs Message Board is the place. There are guys there that have several savage ML's each, including .45 and .40 cal conversions and are nuts about knowing everything, so have all your answers. I love my sav, but invest little time in it, as I am satisfied with what I have gotten. By the way RW is on Dougs Message Board from time to time. 4759 is a popular powder as it is a reliable powder that is not temp sensitive, yet give you good fps performance. If you are looking for higher performance then you could go to 4198 or a duplex load.
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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion If you really want the best advice regarding specifics for powders Dougs Message Board is the place. There are guys there that have several savage ML's each, including .45 and .40 cal conversions and are nuts about knowing everything, so have all your answers. I love my sav, but invest little time in it, as I am satisfied with what I have gotten. By the way RW is on Dougs Message Board from time to time. 4759 is a popular powder as it is a reliable powder that is not temp sensitive, yet give you good fps performance. If you are looking for higher performance then you could go to 4198 or a duplex load. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Chap yes I had read rw's.
Below is some test made useing the 4759 with the old (in the metal cans) and the new (in the plastic jars) I had posted this on Dougs forum back when I did it.You should be able to do a search and find it there.A lot of the shooters are useing the new lot in the plastic jars and are haveing good results with groups.I am going to be useing it pretty soon because I am going to be out of the old soon,shouldn't be a problem have to match the load to the rifle anyhow. The first chart is compareing the old that I had done before on a chrony and the new which was done on a pact. The second is compareing the xtp (3 shot groups) with sst,s (only one shot per load) You can also see some speeds useing the 4198,have shot up to 70 grs useing it. Have shot up to 72 grs of 10x have gotten some really good groups but these loads will rattle your teeth.( And shatter lense in a scope)   |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman Chap yes I had read rw's. Below is some test made useing the 4759 with the old (in the metal cans) and the new (in the plastic jars) I had posted this on Dougs forum back when I did it.You should be able to do a search and find it there.A lot of the shooters are useing the new lot in the plastic jars and are haveing good results with groups.I am going to be useing it pretty soon because I am going to be out of the old soon,shouldn't be a problem have to match the load to the rifle anyhow. The first chart is compareing the old that I had done before on a chrony and the new which was done on a pact. The second is compareing the xtp (3 shot groups) with sst,s (only one shot per load) You can also see some speeds useing the 4198,have shot up to 70 grs useing it. Have shot up to 72 grs of 10x have gotten some really good groups but these loads will rattle your teeth.( And shatter lense in a scope) |
RE: Savage 10 ML
It sure has been fun too.I am going to have to put aside some of my reg
rifles and give the savage some attention.I sure have nelected the savage this year. I have a knight 45 disc thats been sitting here since the first of the year to set up but everytime I think about it I think about haveing to clean it afterwards and just keep putting it off.With the savage its the price of bullets(its the same with reg bullets also was paying $17.99 for a box of sierra 168 match,ran out and stopped by gander mtn and a box there had gone up to $34.99)picked up a box of the sst 250 yesterday and they had gone up to $12 a box.  |
RE: Savage 10 ML
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RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman My best load is the IMR4759 (47.5 grs) 250 sst or sw.and win primers.This is a stout load and gives 2440 fps.I think a lot of fellows use this powder and 42 0r 43 grs and the 250 and 300.  Next here is a TC Shockwave, with the sabot that comes with it, same load, same primer, no swabing, same yardage, cooling barrel with water between shots. Very difficult to load. Had to struggle to get it down the barrel, but I have never shot this good in my entire life, even at 50 yards, with any gun!  Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Good job! I think that the extra heft that the savage gives you, versus a typical rifleand most ML's makes it easier to shoot tighter groups. Its a very good ML, so enjoy yourself.
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RE: Savage 10 ML
Way to go chap,I'm proud of you.
Now do you know the difference in the 2 bullets and sabots. The bullets are the same just a different clored point but the sabots are different one is thicker than the other,If I don't have the numbers backwards the sst are mmp12's and the sw are mmp 24.But you said the sw were harder to get down the barrel.Randy wakeman said a couple years ago that hornady was going to start making their own sabots maybe they have. Before the sw were thinner sabots thus easier to load and the sst were thicker harder to load. I just picked up a new box of the sst and plan on shooting some next week will have to check it out. Again thats a mighty fine group there.You are ready for 200 yds now. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman Way to go chap,I'm proud of you. Now do you know the difference in the 2 bullets and sabots. The bullets are the same just a different clored point but the sabots are different one is thicker than the other,If I don't have the numbers backwards the sst are mmp12's and the sw are mmp 24.But you said the sw were harder to get down the barrel.Randy wakeman said a couple years ago that hornady was going to start making their own sabots maybe they have. Before the sw were thinner sabots thus easier to load and the sst were thicker harder to load. I just picked up a new box of the sst and plan on shooting some next week will have to check it out. Again thats a mighty fine group there.You are ready for 200 yds now. Chap |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: Red Lion Good job! I think that the extra heft that the savage gives you, versus a typical rifleand most ML's makes it easier to shoot tighter groups. Its a very good ML, so enjoy yourself. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Herman and the others have given yougood advice and it appears you are well onyour way already.
I clean my 10II with regular CF techinque/solvents in regards to the bore. Shooters Choice MC#7 to remove fouling (especially plastic), via patch/jag and bore brush. Finish the bore witha thin coat of light gun oil for protection and wipe down the entire rifle with rag and some light gun oil (my preference is BC sheath or barricade as they call it now but anything with rem oil constistency will work). I attend to the breech/vent after most range sessions as i typically will shoot 20-30 per. I place the breech and vent in a bottle of hoppe's 9, etcto sit while cleaning the rest of the rifle.I use a 5/32 drill bit to remove the carbon fouling(chucked in a T handle & hand twist the breech plug), 17 cal bore brush to insure the threads are clean in the plug, thenspray brake cleaner through both plug and vent holes to ensure carbon is removed. I then finish by tumble by hand in a rag with some light gun oil to ensure they are protected. Prior to returning to the range i run a dry patch up& down the bore to remove an excess oil.Also ensure the breech and vent are also not coated in oil by a quick tumble in a dry rag, then install with teflon tape (pink for the breech and white for the ventliner). I have used savage, RW and PR bullets ventliners in all honesty I didn't see any great advantages so I use PR vents now as they are readily available and cheapest. I change my ventliner when the orfice mics + .035" depending on the powder, charge, etc mileage varies but always hunt on a new vent just in case and save those that mic less then .035" for the range. To measure i use torch tips and keep the .032 to .037 ones in my savage toolbox for quick referencing (I colour coded them for identification purposes). I also have done the servicing of the breech via a torque screwdriver and ez tool, they work equally but i like the ez tool for range/hunting reasons and IMO it is money well spent if not wanting a 3rd opillar or bolt release mod.I ama tadanal when it comes to my equipment, so this maybe all for not:eek:! In responseto Randy's comments about 4759, he simply likes this powder the least but in my experience with a number of 10II's it is an excellent choice and the one we always start with and often end with as well. 4759 has been far more consistent then N110 IME - Randy's favorite savage "suggested' powder. I simply can't get N110 to out shoot 4759 in tin or plastic lot numbers and believe me at 80 dollars a jug I have tried too!!!![:@] I personally use 43.5 grs of 4759 with 250gr sst HPH24 sabot and 209w primers, the load avreage's sub moa producing 2300 fps MV and accounted for 4 deer from 50 to 219 yards. 3 dropped on the spot and the other made it a few yards on her nose. I experience excellent terminal performance on 3 shots- pass thrus and lungs in pieces. However 1 was a large bodied buck at just shy of 100 yards and allI had was a flush shoulder shot, the bullet seperated but managed enough to break the entire facing shoulder and send frags to the vitals and spinal cord producing a bang flop occurance. He twitched but by the time I reloaded and made my way to his position he was out. So with such a result I wouldn't suggest the 250sst for elk sized animals in the savage with smokeless velocities. Ido know of 300 gr sst flung from savages that have produced 1 shot kills on elk and moose. I am right now working with 300gr sst for a deer to moose application. I have had success with the same 43.5 gr load of 4759 which produces an average MV in the 2100's, though H4198 has turned in some nice groups with 2300 flashing up on the chrony screen. Though recoil difference are noted:D,but with apachmayr installed this offseason tolerable for me and my scope a Zeiss 3.5x10x44/Warne maxima rings and bases are also holding up just fine. I haven't gotten consistent results from any barnes bullets i have tried much like herman 100 to 200 yards was a stark difference, though my choices are limited up here in canada so take this with a grain of salt. XTP's with short MMP or trimmed HPH24's are my most used bullet but only used them for development for cost saving reasons alone. POI is different, especially at longer ranges but charge potential has shown itself. Having loggedalot of shotsthrough my savagedimes turn into dollars pretty quickly. I would have no problems using the 300 xtp for elk if my range was 200 and under. I have killed moose and black bear with it and subs with 1 shots and good results in other inlines. If looking for 1 load then I'd suggest something in 300 gr or barnes. I'd rather be overkill on deer then marginal on wapati!!:) Congrats on your shooting,rifle and welcome to the smokeless addiction. It is a fun gun to shoot and learn, but anything but easy like many think;);)! Good Luck |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: skeeter 7MM Herman and the others have given yougood advice and it appears you are well onyour way already. I clean my 10II with regular CF techinque/solvents in regards to the bore. Shooters Choice MC#7 to remove fouling (especially plastic), via patch/jag and bore brush. Finish the bore witha thin coat of light gun oil for protection and wipe down the entire rifle with rag and some light gun oil (my preference is BC sheath or barricade as they call it now but anything with rem oil constistency will work). I attend to the breech/vent after most range sessions as i typically will shoot 20-30 per. I place the breech and vent in a bottle of hoppe's 9, etcto sit while cleaning the rest of the rifle.I use a 5/32 drill bit to remove the carbon fouling(chucked in a T handle & hand twist the breech plug), 17 cal bore brush to insure the threads are clean in the plug, thenspray brake cleaner through both plug and vent holes to ensure carbon is removed. I then finish by tumble by hand in a rag with some light gun oil to ensure they are protected. Prior to returning to the range i run a dry patch up& down the bore to remove an excess oil.Also ensure the breech and vent are also not coated in oil by a quick tumble in a dry rag, then install with teflon tape (pink for the breech and white for the ventliner). I have used savage, RW and PR bullets ventliners in all honesty I didn't see any great advantages so I use PR vents now as they are readily available and cheapest. I change my ventliner when the orfice mics + .035" depending on the powder, charge, etc mileage varies but always hunt on a new vent just in case and save those that mic less then .035" for the range. To measure i use torch tips and keep the .032 to .037 ones in my savage toolbox for quick referencing (I colour coded them for identification purposes). I also have done the servicing of the breech via a torque screwdriver and ez tool, they work equally but i like the ez tool for range/hunting reasons and IMO it is money well spent if not wanting a 3rd opillar or bolt release mod.I ama tadanal when it comes to my equipment, so this maybe all for not:eek:! In responseto Randy's comments about 4759, he simply likes this powder the least but in my experience with a number of 10II's it is an excellent choice and the one we always start with and often end with as well. 4759 has been far more consistent then N110 IME - Randy's favorite savage "suggested' powder. I simply can't get N110 to out shoot 4759 in tin or plastic lot numbers and believe me at 80 dollars a jug I have tried too!!!![:@] I personally use 43.5 grs of 4759 with 250gr sst HPH24 sabot and 209w primers, the load avreage's sub moa producing 2300 fps MV and accounted for 4 deer from 50 to 219 yards. 3 dropped on the spot and the other made it a few yards on her nose. I experience excellent terminal performance on 3 shots- pass thrus and lungs in pieces. However 1 was a large bodied buck at just shy of 100 yards and allI had was a flush shoulder shot, the bullet seperated but managed enough to break the entire facing shoulder and send frags to the vitals and spinal cord producing a bang flop occurance. He twitched but by the time I reloaded and made my way to his position he was out. So with such a result I wouldn't suggest the 250sst for elk sized animals in the savage with smokeless velocities. Ido know of 300 gr sst flung from savages that have produced 1 shot kills on elk and moose. I am right now working with 300gr sst for a deer to moose application. I have had success with the same 43.5 gr load of 4759 which produces an average MV in the 2100's, though H4198 has turned in some nice groups with 2300 flashing up on the chrony screen. Though recoil difference are noted:D,but with apachmayr installed this offseason tolerable for me and my scope a Zeiss 3.5x10x44/Warne maxima rings and bases are also holding up just fine. I haven't gotten consistent results from any barnes bullets i have tried much like herman 100 to 200 yards was a stark difference, though my choices are limited up here in canada so take this with a grain of salt. XTP's with short MMP or trimmed HPH24's are my most used bullet but only used them for development for cost saving reasons alone. POI is different, especially at longer ranges but charge potential has shown itself. Having loggedalot of shotsthrough my savagedimes turn into dollars pretty quickly. I would have no problems using the 300 xtp for elk if my range was 200 and under. I have killed moose and black bear with it and subs with 1 shots and good results in other inlines. If looking for 1 load then I'd suggest something in 300 gr or barnes. I'd rather be overkill on deer then marginal on wapati!!:) Congrats on your shooting,rifle and welcome to the smokeless addiction. It is a fun gun to shoot and learn, but anything but easy like many think;);)! Good Luck I have used the white tape in my guns before and don't see much advantage to it. The thicker pink kind was too thick, wouldn't go in easy. Yes I need to get some of that 4759, seems like a lot of folks use that because it has more power. Agree with you on the 300g bullets they do a good. I like the XTPs, for shooting/practice, my son usesthem for hunting, I use Noslers.I tend to stay at 300g with all my bullets. I will go as low a 285g with the Barnes TMZ but I like the extra 50g of weight, they tend to punch thru big bodied deer. Little avg size doe, they make a mess of but your not huntin' them, you have to be prepared for Big Boy. Thanks for your wisdom Skeeter, I appreciate your willingness to share expecially your long range terminal performance experience and the cleaning of the plug/vent liner. The Savages are anything but easy, I think you can "be easy" to just shoot factory recommendations, clean the rifle at end of season and put it away with the CF rifles in your collection. But there is tremendious complexity in every turn with this gun for those of us who want accuracy and killing power. I want accuracy and killing power to 200 yards. Chap Gleason |
RE: Savage 10 ML
Skeeter,good post and good advice on cleaning the savage.The reason I don't use heavier bullets is because I don't need them for the size of deer here,but if I was hunting larger animals I would probably use heavier bullets too.Really a 185 gr and 200 gr will do the job on them here but cannot get the smaller bullets to shoot that good out of the savage.I use a nosler 185 out of a ruger,and 200gr out of a encore.The spitfires I tried in the savage were the 245 gr shot 2 three shot groups on different days that were one holers,went to 200 yds and they just really spread out.
Chap were are you located in Va,I hunted up there years ago a few years before my wife got sick(over 16 yrs ago) around lake moomaw,took lot of deer with a bow,rifle and muzzleloader,really wanted to get a bear with my bow but never did even see one even during the gun season. Below is a couple pics of deer I shot with the savage year before last,killed a doe sat opening day,think it was 234 yds,cannot remember the exact yardages,monday shot the 10 pointer,170 yds,tuesday shot the eight pointer running across the power line at 100 yds,it went about 75 yds before pilling up,shot the 6 pointer about an hour later.This past year shot a 5 pointer at 160 yds,spike at 200 and spike at 230 yds.   |
RE: Savage 10 ML
What are PR vents BTW your choice in powder my not be the most speediest but who'd argue with your results. I have got a little caught up in the chrony I admit more b/c of curiosity and wowing potential but I'd take 200 fps less and an iddy bitty group anyday over a erratic barn burner. 5744 is a bit iffy here in regards to availability and thus I have spent very little time with it, though I did notice its potential, light kiss back and fouling!!! 4759 is as common as bottled water and gets the savage to where it is intended in terms of performance, other eclipse this powder yet with less pressure and safely. Basically boils down to how much you want to invest, shoot and tinker, though I don't think any critter will ever know the velocity difference if its lungs have been deflated;)! Enjoy |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: skeeter 7MM I clean my 10II with regular CF techinque/solvents in regards to the bore. Shooters Choice MC#7 to remove fouling (especially plastic), via patch/jag and bore brush. I simply can't get N110 to out shoot 4759 in tin or plastic lot numbers and believe me at 80 dollars a jug I have tried too!!!![:@] I haven't gotten consistent results from any barnes bullets i have tried much like herman 100 to 200 yards was a stark difference, though my choices are limited up here in canada so take this with a grain of salt. I would have no problems using the 300 xtp for elk if my range was 200 and under. Congrats on your shooting,rifle and welcome to the smokeless addiction. It is a fun gun to shoot and learn, but anything but easy like many think;);)! Good Luck Agree with you on the XTP, I am glad to learn that you consider them a 200 yard bullet, because I figured 150. I have to look at the ballistics. I downloaded that free balistics program(PointBlank v 1.8)and plan on working with it to get some good sight in for 100 yard, how high at 100 to be dead on at 200. It is very interesting to shoot the Savage, because you basically limited to Sabots <= 300g and certain kinds of Smokeless powders. Thanks for the info on the 4759. Is it $80 for a 1 lb can? If so that is 4 times the cost of the AA 5744. Now $80 for a 5 lb can is a very good price. I will look into that powder once I get to a place that I can buy it and if it is resonable. We are not exactly in ML heaven here in Norther Va. In fact it is downright hard to get stuff for ML except over the Internet. Chap Gleason |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: herman Chap were are you located in Va,I hunted up there years ago a few years before my wife got sick(over 16 yrs ago) around lake moomaw,took lot of deer with a bow,rifle and muzzleloader,really wanted to get a bear with my bow but never did even see one even during the gun season. |
RE: Savage 10 ML
ORIGINAL: skeeter 7MM What are PR vents BTW your choice in powder my not be the most speediest but who'd argue with your results. I have got a little caught up in the chrony I admit more b/c of curiosity and wowing potential but I'd take 200 fps less and an iddy bitty group anyday over a erratic barn burner. 5744 is a bit iffy here in regards to availability and thus I have spent very little time with it, though I did notice its potential, light kiss back and fouling!!! 4759 is as common as bottled water and gets the savage to where it is intended in terms of performance, other eclipse this powder yet with less pressure and safely. Basically boils down to how much you want to invest, shoot and tinker, though I don't think any critter will ever know the velocity difference if its lungs have been deflated;)! Enjoy As for the 5744, the only reason I started with that powder is Randy Wakeman's web site said it is "more forgiving" and some stay with it all the time.I didn't rally know what it ment, but figured it was a good starting powder. He also said "some stay with it". I may stay with it also given my holes with the TC ShockWaves, if I stay with that bullet. I am not convinced that the TC SWis the best bullet for elk, because of separation of jacket from bullet issues that I have read about, and the shooting test done into wet newspaper over on Doug's Message Board. However if I can only get 3" out of a Barnes, then I will go to the TC ShockWaves. However if the Barnes shoot 1.5" at 100 yards then I will go with the Barnes since I know they hold together on bigger game.That is my logic on bullet selection for Elk in Rifle Season using a ML in Colorado. If there are other 200 yard bullet out there I would like to know about them, and what I mean by 200 yard bullets is from Muzzle to 200 yards no more than 6" drop in bullet over that range. Chap Gleason Chap |
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