Flintlocks
 

What is there to know about shooting a flinter? I know how it works and all of that but here is what I know:

You use FFFFG powder
you need a good flint
pick the touch hole after each shot
they are fun!

I know how the whole thing works and I read about it in my TC booklet. So what tools do you need for a flinter? Some day I would like to get into flintlocks.

RE: Flintlocks
 

You really don't need to pic the vent after every shot. The FFFF is just for prime. Keep the frizzen and pan clean of fowling for best ignition. I just use basic tools I already own with mine.

RE: Flintlocks
 

The flintlock is really more more complicated then a cap lock if you have all the parts right. Also my Lyman Trade Rifle with a sharp flint is every bit as fast as a percussion cap rifle for ignition. At least I'd hate to live on the difference.

The main thing is keep the flint knapped and sharp. Once that flint gets dull the problems start to begin. My problem is I have no skills when it comes to knapping. I have to get out the dremel tool with a mizzy wheel and edge it that way. It works mind you just not very traditional. If I have a new flint in the rifle it is good for about 25 shots and sometimes more. Then you have to knapp a little.

Also flintlocks.. use black powder. All the hype about these other powders will work in a flintlock.. yes they will. You might have to duplex the load with black powder and as for synthetic powders in the pan.. well good luck getting it to fire and when it does you better have nerves of steel for the hang time.

In fact I looked at a T/C Firestorm today. Then told myself I did not need another rifle. I bought a couple tins of caps and left the sporting good store quickly. :D

RE: Flintlocks
 

Cayugad: I told myself I didn't need another rifle three rifles ago. I now have five and one kit that isn't finished since I don't have any time these days. I need to be three people so that two of me could go out and play. (That is five muzzleloaders; I would have to go count the others since I don't have a quick number to quote).

RE: Flintlocks
 

I stopped counting rifles a couple dozen ago... :D

RE: Flintlocks
 

flintlocks are a blast......and to me very addicting...i dont shoot half as much as some of these guys....but i dont have the time or easy place to shoot...and only own one flinter....only BP gun i own or ever fired though...you REALLY dont need anything too special...a pan charger to throw powder in the pan...and all the basic tools you need for any other BP gun....the TC manual is a very good one i feel....thats basically how i learned....and on here(mainly cayugad!) and i had a guy i know take me out and show me the ropes....he just taught me to do what the manual said to do basically...since then i picked up my own techniques and all....a GOOD lock is important....and a good frizzen and a good sharp flint.....i cant knap a flint to save my life..i can break off a few pieces sometimes and get a few extra shots..but i have a jar full of dull flints..so when i learn to knapp ill be good to go on flints for the rest of my time lol...when shooting you gota keep it all clean and dry...i soak patches in rubbing alcohol and wipe it all down...when hunting i do it from time to time..and sweep the pan pretty often....that guy that took me shooting the firt time gave me atleast a half pound of 4fg...so i dont mind dumping it....guys say its hard to find around here...i watch some of them dump it back in there powder container.....not me...i want to know my guns going to go boom when i pull the trigger....the guys in my group think im nuts always cleaning it..dumping priming charges...unloading daily..but i want to make sure it goes bang....and mine always does.....i cant wait till im outa college and i can build a big smoothbore for turkeys n such critters....that would be absolutely AWESOME...big ole cloud of smoke on a warm spring morning and a big ole gobbler on the ground...and flintlocks can be every bit as accurate as any other BP rifle....i killed a groundhog at 45yds....havent got a deer with it yet....i cant wait to shoot here soon...i just got glasses and contacts..ill beable to SEE MY SIGHTS! lol...before it was all a blurr..i have a BAD astigmatism and finally got it corrected...i should be in good shape.....any questions post away.....alot of good help here....

RE: Flintlocks
 

sharp...I have shot flintlocks since 1977....I don't even own a percussion...remember flintlocks were in common use for over 200 years, longer than any other ignition system...First, you can load and prime with FFF...I have used FFFF to prime, but it is not necessary...Second, stick with a great lock....I prefer a Siler (Chambers) etc...Third, use English black flints...knapping is easy, take a finishing nail, grind off the point and use a little brass hammer to flake off the leading edge, while moving the nail along the edge, or you can just put the cock at half cock and lightly tap the leading edge with the hammer, while holding your finger under the flint....

I never had problems with making a flinter work, when I got started I didn't know anybody that owned a flinter, first trip to range and I was shooting 1 1/2 inch groups at 50 yards...If your prime is dry, flint sharp, touch hole coned and open, main charge dry the gun will fire, its just that simple....

You do need to realize that a flint lock will fire without prime....Don't check the sparking of the lock with a charge down the barrel....

RE: Flintlocks
 

Amen! Don't think it won't! I agree, good locks are a must. A mediocre percussion lock will work most of the time, a mediocre flintlock will drive you crazy. Jim Chambers locks are my favorite.

Some old timers loded their flinters with a quilll or feather stuck in the vent hole. This supposedly kept a cone shaped void in the powder charge for faster ignition. Don't know if this works or not. I haven't seen any improvment by doing that. I do use a wooden pick in the vent when stand hunting, especially when the humidity is up. Stick the pick in the vent and close the frizzen, protects it and holds it in place. Simple matter to pull it out and fresh prime when ready to shoot. Definately makes ignition faster and more sure under damp conditions.

RE: Flintlocks
 

/sigh, wish I was able to comment on this earlier.

Sharp: I have been shooting a flintlock for a few months now. There is bit of a learning curve in getting it to fire consistently. However once over that, flintlocks are a lot of fun.

One warning though: be prepared for a lot of attention at the range. Guys have seen percussion weapons so those are not a big deal. But flintlocks? Never. I have had strangers/on-lookers stand right beside me while loading and shooting. If you are prepared for it and can take the questions/attention in stride, it is not too big a deal.

Best of luck.
~Robert

RE: Flintlocks
 

next time maybe one of them will stand to close to the touch hole liner side and learn another important lesson about flintlocks.. fire comes out that hole! Like RobertSubnet was saying, people sure seem fascinated by the rock locks. You can almost see them hold their breath when you are about to shoot...

RE: Flintlocks
 

A few years back (about 20-25) I was coming back home to NC after a meeting in Atlanta...I had my Bob Watts .45 flinter in the trunk and decided to stop at a shooting range on the way home, I had bought some new powder and wanted to make sure my gun shot it OK....I made a target consisting of a 1 inch square on a piece of paper, I posted down range and was walking back to the shooting shelter when a truck load of guys pulled up with their deer rifles....These guys got out and started making comments about my "flintrock", "flinchrock", "musket" etc....I took a standing rest on one of the shelter poles and touched "Sweetheart" off....From 50 yards away it looked as if I missed....One of the guys walked down range and hollered back...."That SOB put a hole right in the middle"...Sure enough I couldn't have placed it any truer...He bought my target back, I said "Looks like she's good to go"....Packed up my stuff and left.....I wouldn't have shot another round in front of them for
50 bucks. ;)

RE: Flintlocks
 

Oh and one other thing:

I read a test somewhere for lock speed. If your flintlock is tuned properly, it will be able to fire upside down.

Well I tried this one afternoon and sure enough it does work! However you must wear a heavy long sleeve shirt, preferably something fire resistant. When firing upside down the powder will burn down and outward toward your arm. If unprotectedthe burning powder will burn/injure you...

...as I learned one day, the hard way!

~Robert
PS: But it makes for a great story: "there I was, it was a hunred' degrees in the shade.."

RE: Flintlocks
 

Almost any flintlock will shoot upside down.I of course had to try it on my flintlocks like everyone else does, and sure enough, they fire just fine. I also showed that to two young and upcoming muzzleloader shooters at my range. Their father brought his clan over to shoot a newmuzzleloader and get some tech advise. I was shooting my Lyman Trade Rifle .54 caliber flintlock and they were fascinated with the thing. When I told them it would fire upside down, I could see I had them hooked. They doubted it. When it went off I never seen two young boys so tickled. It also helps rid the notion that flintlocks are hard to get to fire. I hear that all the time from my friends.Theytell me, thats a nice looking rifle, too bad they don't fire all the time. The longest stretch I had without a misfire was well over 20 shots. That's with a agate on the Lyman rifle. With flints, if I knew how to knapp I am sure I could get more then that before the thing refuses to ignite the powder. They are fun to shoot without a doubt.

RE: Flintlocks
 

Cayugad.. HOW DOES THE LYMAN TRDE RIFLE COMPARE WITH THE RENEGADE AS FAR AS OVERALL WEIGHT,I ALWAYS LIKE TO GET A FLINTER IN THE TRADE MODEL IN 54 CAL. AND A FLINTER
TOO BAD THEY DID NOT MAKE THE BARREL IN A 1 IN 66 TWIST

RE: Flintlocks
 

They are very close in weight and balance. Although the Trade Rifle is much more comfortable to shoot a powerful load because of the stock design. I agree, if that rifle had a 1-60 twist like the GPR that would really make a great rifle.

RE: Flintlocks
 

I happen to have a custom made Isaac Haines Pennsylvania Rifle. Actually, it is a reproduction of an Isaac Haines rifle, made by my Uncle. It sports a 38" Getz barrel with a 1:56" twist, swamped of course. Siler lock and double set triggers. It wieghs in at 7 1/2 pounds and is 54 caliber. It is truly an eye opener to shoot a quality flintlock. Prior to this rifle I had a T/C Hawken in 54 caliber. The custom rifle is much faster, lighter, accurate, and pleasant to shoot.

Some myths about flintlocks -

Use FFFF for priming. The truth is, FFF works better for hunting. The larger powder has less surface area than FFFF and thus gets wet slower. Also, FFF is a coated powder, FFFF is not.

Use FF for main charge. The truth is you CAN use FF, but why when FFF works just as well and you use less powder for the same amount of velocity? Thus, if you use FFF for both prime and main charge you carry only one powder horn.

1:48" twist is a compromise between bullets and balls. Truth is, 1:48" twist doesnt really work well for anything.

Round ball guns need 1:60, 66, or 72" twist. Truth is, they dont. My 1:56" twist shoots rings around my Uncle's 1:72" twist gun.

Round ball guns are only good for 100 yards or less. Utter hogwash. The limitation on a roundball gun is the reliability of the shooter to place the shot.

RE: Flintlocks
 

While I agree with you ought six on many points there are a couple that I guess I might hold a different opinion.

I have a number of 1:48 twists which are outstanding roundball shooting rifles. Not that I would enter them in a shooting competition, but for hunting they are more then acceptable. While I am not saying all 1:48 twist are, there are many moderate twist barrels what will hold their own with many of the "roundball" barrels. Their advantage is many of them will shoot conical loads well at the same time. Which makes them a nice all around twist for the average shooter.

The reason many people consider roundball rifles a 100 yard rifle is the amount/degree of energy the ball has lost at that point. While there are cases where roundball have taken game all the way to 200 yards, the "average" roundball shooter does not have the skill to make such shots with their rifle much further. As you said, the limitation of the roundball is by ones ability to place the shot. As much as I practice with a number of roundball rifles, I would still limit my .50 calibers to 100 yards and the .54 and bigger to 125 yard tops. That's the best I personally feel comfortable with. If a person and their rifle can only hit and produce an average group at 50 yards, then that is all the rifle should be used at when hunting.

Also the FFF prime is good advise. I have two pounds of FFFF which I have slowly been shooting off now for a couple years, when I was told I needed it for priming my pans...:D

RE: Flintlocks
 

[quoteSome myths about flintlocks -

Use FFFF for priming. The truth is, FFF works better for hunting. The larger powder has less surface area than FFFF and thus gets wet slower. Also, FFF is a coated powder, FFFF is not.

Use FF for main charge. The truth is you CAN use FF, but why when FFF works just as well and you use less powder for the same amount of velocity? Thus, if you use FFF for both prime and main charge you carry only one powder horn.

1:48" twist is a compromise between bullets and balls. Truth is, 1:48" twist doesnt really work well for anything.

Round ball guns need 1:60, 66, or 72" twist. Truth is, they dont. My 1:56" twist shoots rings around my Uncle's 1:72" twist gun.

Round ball guns are only good for 100 yards or less. Utter hogwash. The limitation on a roundball gun is the reliability of the shooter to place the shot.

][/quote]

I can't be quite that dogmatic . I've played with traditionalmuzzleloaders and realBP for about 30 years now. I've been blessed to play with some good custom guns by some talented people, some guns I have built, and many production guns, some fairly expensive, and some pretty cheap. The one homest word you wil find in most descriptions about guns on general, and even more so with ML is USUALY. For instance, . I've seen some 1/48 barrels that were accurate way beyond what they "should" be, with ball or conical. I've seen 1/72 shoot better than 1/56, and also the other way around. Every firearm is an individual, and every one is different. You can say, quite legitemately, [quote My 1:56" twist shoots rings around my Uncle's 1:72" twist gun.
][/quote]
I'm sure it is true. I am also sure there is a 1/72 barrel out there that will beat your 1/56.
Some of my guns, rifle and smoothbore, shoot better with FFg than FFFg. I like carrying one powder when hunting, so I often use FFFg because I am lazy, not because it works just as well.

Not trying to argue, just making a note about some of the things I have seen over the years. Your miliage may vary...