Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

My nephew is going to be hunting (mule deer)this year andhe seems to be interested in muzzleloading. Ihave a few packs of 295 PB's I bought at Walmart on clearancefor $4.50 a pack and was thinking about letting himhunt with them. As I have some good locations for him to stand, I was thinking I might work up a light load for up to 100 yards.

What I had in mind was 50 grs.BM3 for a MV of about 1375 fps and recoil about 75% a 12 gauge bird load. Energy at a 100 yds should be about 800 ft. lbs, though i do expect that he won't need to shoot over 60 yards where he'll take his stand.

I haven't shot any of them yet and I have some concerns about whether the velocity is sufficient to get the bullet to engage rifling. Has anyone got any ideas as to whether this would be a be successful undertaking?

Happy Hunting, Phil

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

Phil -

Keep us posted on your results with the lower velocity powerbelts. I often feel that many of the people that experience problems with them are really, pushing them too hard in the first place. Your results should be interesting.

I think that would be a fine load if placed in the proper spot...

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

There was an episode of mythbusters where they were trying to see if a person was safe jumping into water when being shot at. They submerged a 1.5ft cube of ballistics gel about 3 ft under water. they shot it with all kinds of guns. The hand guns and the black powder rifle were the only ones whose bullets,or fragments of, made it into the gel. Even the huge Barret 50 cal firing 600 grains of smokeless behind a cinder block of a bullet shattered on impact with the water. That tells you strenght isn't everything! A 50 cal bullet doesn'tneed to go fast to kill, at reasonable short distances, of course. I'malso interested in seeing what you come up with. Keep us posted.

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

I tried them,it takes a 150 gr load of FF to get tight groups in my Omega and they fragament like a varmit bullet,my System one would not even keep them on the paper. I hope you get better results than Ihave. Lee

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

I too will be interested in the results. Powerbelts will drop down most barrels if you take off the plastic skirt. They depend upon heat and pressure to "obturate" and fill the lands/grooves. I am thinking the 50 grain charge will be too low to cause the upset. The bullet will tumble in flight.

For charges on the high end, the problem has been that the excessive heat and pressure cause the stem at the base of the bullet to upset and hold the plastic skirt on there all the way to the target. Apparently, this is an accuracy issue. Particularly if this happens somewhat inconsistently.

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

Roskoe,I tried them with every thing from 80 to 150 AAP and they had two loads they shot good with but they shot so much better with 150 or 3 sticks that I did not pay much attenton to the light load.The plastic sleeves look like they have been turned inside out with that load but they were grouping in 1.5 inch at 100yd.When I read some of the stuff about penatration problems I shot one into wet telephone books and it blew like my 223 does with a varmit bullet; I am not sure what velocity taht they are desigined for but it definatlly is not 2100 or higher.Lee

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

I don't think they gave much thought as to the design for terminal performance. The powerbelt, like anypure lead bullet, softens up above 1600 fps. Above 2000 fps, they can melt. My sense is that the copper plating doesn't come close to constituting a jacket and that, in the end, the powerbelt isonly an under-bore size pure lead conical.

As such, the powerbelts at velocities in the 1300 to 1500 fps would mushroom nicely without any hollowpoint needed. Above1600 fps they are going to squash on target withoutany hollowpoint. Add the hollowpoint, and they are explosive at those velocities, especially the lighter ones. The lighter bullets, especially,needa harder alloy for the velocities we are encouraged to sling them at (e.g. > 2000 fps), however, that would probably prevent engagment of the rifling.


As for the lower velocities,the 295 is the lower limit that I would feel comfortable using them.Starting with only 1350 fps or so velocity, and owing to inferior ballistic efficiency, the lighter bulletscarry a momentum density which lower than I would feel comfortable, especially because of the hollowpoint.

I'll try the 295's out this weekend and let everyone know if they group for me at velocities below 1400 fps. BTW, I've been planning to get a hog with my brother to slaughter. When we do, and if the 295's group , i will dispatch it (double lung)with a 295 at the 100 yard velocity of the load and report the terminal performance.

Happy Hunting, Phil

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

I killed two deer with 295 gr powerbelts pushed with 100 gr of Pyrodex from my CVA 50 last month. Both deer dropped in their tracks. There was a lot of tissue damage but the bullet made a complete pass through on both so I did not recover either one of the bullets. One was about 60 yds the other about 120 yds. I did get some pretty tight groups when sighting in at home. Herein SD we must not have scopes on during ml season so by tight group I am talking about 2 to 3 inches at a hundred yards. I may try some more with hollow point PBs after the spring snow goose over so I have more time.

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

Great to hear of your success. It would be interesting tolearn where your load chronos. I figure about 1650 +- 40 fps. I'll drop 100 grains RSand chrono it this weekend. Between 60yards and 120 yards, your load is very close to the low velocity load Im proposing for my nephew between the muzzle and 60 yards, which is the range I expect him to be shooting.

So your success is very encouraging, thanks for the input!

Happy Hunting, Phil

RE: Powerbelts at lower velocities?
 

Pqasqow, if they don't work out you might consider the 50/40 sabot with a 195 or 200 gr 40 cal bulletwith a hundred gr of powderthe recoil is minimal and they have been used on elk and mooseand worked well, so deer should not be a problem, in my particular gun [an Omega ] they group with any load from 90 up with any powder. Lee