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Best all around gun for big game
I'm getting a new savage rifle, the 110 package rifle. It comes in
270, 30-06, and 7mag. Which one would you choose for an all around big game gun? Mule deer, antelope, whitetail, elk, and hogs will be all I need it for. Any of them seem good, but if it was you... which one would you choose? Why? I wish I could find a 280 for the same price <img src=icon_smile_sad.gif border=0 align=middle>. How far is ya'll average shot? "Hey ya'll, watch this" |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
I'd go for the 30-06, reason is its my favorite gun, used it to kill deer and elk, my farthest shot with it has been 400 yards and that was to kill a black bear. I shot my elk this year with the 30-06 200 yard shot right through the neck she dropped in her tracks.
"ATTITUDE REFLECTS LEADERSHIP, CAPTAIN!" |
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
My choice would be the 7mm mag as it shoots flatter than the other two and recoil is easily tolerated by most shooters.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
Any would work, but I would chose the 7 Mag as well. It will give you a more power than the 270 and is flatter than the 06. Good bullet selection available and reasonable to shoot for a mag.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
Everyone here in Georgia I have met that shoots a 7mag has bad hearing loss. When hog hunting, you may need to shoot a good many times, and sometimes a few shots in a row. How bad is the muzzleblast compaired to the 06 with 180g bullets? Recoil doesn't get to me bad, but muzzleblast does.
"Hey ya'll, watch this" |
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
I would go with the 7 mag but all 3 are very good rounds, 7 mag just shoots a bit flatter than the 06 and hits harder than the other 2 with a heavier bullet. As far as muzzle blast my buddy has a 24" barrelled mod 70 in 270 and it is very noisy as noisy as my 7 mags have been so I wouldn't take that into account.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
I would go with the 7mm mag. If you wear ears at the range you shouldn't have a hearing loss problem. Even a lot of shooting in the field shouldn't effect hearing, at least not much more than the 06. I and a couple guys I know do not have hearing problems due to the 7mm mag. I feel the 7mm mag is a step up from the 06 and I disagree with the guy who said the ballistics aren't all that different at long ranges between the 06 and 7mm. In my opinion within about 200 yds they are about the same maybe with even a slight edge to the 06. After that the 06 really starts to drop off compared the the 7mm. the 7mm shoots flatter and carries it energy much better at long ranges. Realistically with lots of practice and the right shells you can take a bull elk at 400 yds with it, I don't believe you can with an 06, it loses too much energy.
Edited by - rather_be_huntin on 12/19/2002 17:52:11 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
If muzzle blast/recoil tends to make you flinch, go for the 30-06, if not consider the 7mm, but otherwise toss a coin. Eliminate the 270 if elk is on the plate. Yes, it is good elk medicine, but not the best in my book.
To answer your question about what is the best gun for big game, I would answer that there is no best. That is why over the years, I have accumulated a 222, 243, 270, 7mm mag, and a 338 win mag. Also a 54 caliber muzzleloader. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Stubblejumper hit the nail on the head! The 7mm really shines at long range.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
Does Savage offer the 280 in the 111 line? If so I don't think that the 111 is that much more. Check out Auctionarms.com, they seem to have alot of Savages for sale there. The 30.06 will take an elk at 400yds no problem and shoots flat with 165 Nosler Partition with 57.5gr of IMR4350. Sight it in 3in high at 100yds and you will be close to dead on at 300. 7mm with 160 Partition and 63gr of RL22 will be going 3058fps, the .06 is going 2872. These numbers are right out of Nosler Manual. I guess I'm just luckey to have a 270, .06, 7mm, 300 win, 338win and I lovem all!
Never pass up a shot! |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
7mm Mag. Good luck.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
I'd pick the 30-06 if elk were on the plate. The 30 cal has heavier bullets and more importantly more cross sectional area which helps when the target gets bigger. No matter what anyone says, a 30 cal will always be better on larger game than a 7mm. This coming from a guy who's shot over 50 whitetails and a few other critters with a 7mm mag. It's a great round, but for versatility the 30-06 is the hands down winner.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
I am with the 06 gang. I do own a 7mm and wouldnt tell you to shoot moose or elk with it, although its perfectly capable of killing them.
The 06 is the perfect all around hunting rifle out of your 3 choices! If one is worried about tajectory.....get closer. The 7mm is faster, but doenst pack the energy the 06 does. It will work on deer and pigs just as well as moose and kodiak brown bears! |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
When the season is over some of the hunters got game and some don't. About an equal number of both will be holding the same rifles. I'm purely a hunter, not a gunnut. I'm just not sure it makes a hoot of difference.Wouldn't go with 270 if you hunt critters bigger than deer often. Can't go wrong with '06. Cheaper ammo. Kills just as dead. Best long range game getter is using your feet to get closer. Most mod. cartridges shoot furthur than people can hit. Most guys who own a flatter shooter don't/can't practice at extended ranges and generally don't take advantage of capabilities.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
Kodiak, in 'sponse ta yer thread "Best al'round gun fer big game" well thayr ain't no such thing. No one gun 'll do it all - its all a trade off 'n I thinks you knows that already. If yall wants ta take a wide range o' game then yous bett'r have more'n one rifle!
270, 3006, 7Mag? The onlyst choices allowed fer this here all round big game shoot'n iron? yer kinda limit'n yerself a bit. 30-06? 'Cordin' to whatya said earlier on 'nother thread yous already got an '06 so I'd recommend you not buy another! 270? If'ns you already got a '06 then 270 ain't movin' up. 7Mag? I hear you say'n yer afeared o' losin' yer hearin wit' a 7Mag so yall best not get one o' them either! Gess I'd jus' have to suggest ya keep the ol' 30-06 'n save yer money or put the denero into 'd best scope yall kin stand, sumptin' like a Leupold 'r better. If y'all kin hit, then thet '06 will take care o' de middle of de road game! On the ot'r hand ifn's ya jus caint get rid of the urge to buy 'nother shoot'n iron 'n you want enuff select'n in yer rack to cover all the Nort' American continent 'n do a right fine job on elk then add a 338 sumpthin to yer rack 'n be done wit' it! Use a big recoil pad 'n use ear p'tect'n when shoot'n target 'n when its live fire it won'st matt'r none at all! Wish'n fer a 280 'eh? 280 n' 7mag is both .284 bullit on diffr'nt casin's. Jus' use reduc'd load charges in the 7mag, slow it up 200-250fps 'n yer there but sure wudn't call it an "alroun' big game rifle." I worry 'bout you kodiak |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
You worry about me? Aw! It's nice to know you care.<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
You are very contraceptive in looking at the other posts I have. I sold my old 30-06 last week looking for something that wasn't so ugly. I can't stand a sythetic stock! I was hoping it would grow on me, but the more I looked at that thing the uglier it got. I might get another '06. Probably a savage model 111G. The 7 mag just looked and sounded so, um...neat. I don't think the recoil or noise would bother me much once I got used to it. The reason I put the 270 down there was just because alot of people really like them. Rackem, you sound like you know what you are talking about. What is the 338 like? "Hey ya'll, watch this" |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Rackem,
No offense meant, but please lose the ebonics and post in english. Judging by the way you threw in an apostrophe at every turn I think you actually know how to put together a sentence and are just trying to be cute. However, it makes your post very, very hard to read. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Kod,
how do you plan on getting used to the noise? By loosing your hearing enuf it wont matter? Sorry as a fairly young ex musician, I have to say its one of the best moves I have made EVER! (getting out of the music world completly) Getting away from trumpets blaring in the back of my head as loud, high, and piercing as they can without thought or care to whats happening or whose it affecting around them. Not to mention the rest of the myriad of instruments from 120 piece orchestra's to a small trio of xmas music playin fools.... Even shooting at game, each shot causes irreplacable hearing loss! It dont matter when you cant hear enuf to no better! Yup yer rit der! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle> Just another reason to be a bowhunter!!! |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
In general I agree with most of the every day posters and hunters here that the old 30-06 is probably the perfect cartridge for hunting in the lower 48 states. If you want to try something else, well go for it, I have and found some great cartridges but come back tot he 06 often.
Noise and recoil, how to deal with them. First use hearing protection at the range and go to the range often. Learn to hold that weapon in the 10 ring and call the shots. Covering the ears IS A MUST and for recoil get a shoulder pad. IN the field when you hunt, at least when I hunt, I hear NO noise feel NO recoil. Got other things on my mind out there. I now shoot a 338 win mag because I like it for my elk and deer hunting, UNLESS I am down in sage brush mainly looking for deer or antelope. Thats when I pull out the 06 and a bullet weight for better flat shooting. If you can, start with a light caliber, 243, move ot 308, 30-06 etc until you find what works well for you. NOw if you want the fast track? Find a buddy like I did who loads 45-70 up to 458 strength, fire off in a 8 # rifle OR shoot 2 oz turkey loads in a 6 # shot gun. Do either a few times, and believe me, everything becomes like a BB rifle. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
lilhunter,
How do you get used to noise? Same way I got used to my '06, shoot it once or twice and learn to expect it to be that loud and that it's not going to hurt you. Once you expect that roaring boom! that's that. I always wear ear plugs on the range. and when I shoot in the woods I normaly don't hear anything if thier is a deer or elk in front of me. coloelkhunter, Start with a 243? You mean that in general you would start with a 243 and then over the years you would find what works best for you. ok. I've just got rid of my 30/06 and it worked "ok". I have no doubt it would work on anything if you were close enough. I am kind of asking now if the 7mag is "much" more punishing to shoot than a 06. Or if the 30-06 is an all around better rifle. "Hey ya'll, watch this" |
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
KodiakHuntMaster - Recommend you replace the .30-06 you sold with another .30-06 as your mid-range rifle which certainly fulfill your desire for a "best all around gun for big game" rifle for an area of 1500 miles of where you live. If you decide to expand your toolbox of weapons and your range of hunting further north and/or west to include elk, moose, and bear (per your handle) it is hard to go wrong with the .338 mag. It's been called the "magnum for those who are recoil shy." Once you use one it hard to walk away from that extra "slap down power." I've used the 338mag on antelope, deer, and elk even though I have a 270, 3006, and 308 available - just like the way it brings everything to a quick end. Someone in Georgia has to own one, work your connections, find them and arrange to shoot it. Kick isn't bad and the muzzle blast compared to a 7Mag is deep and throaty instead of an ear ripping "crack."
EKM Good judgment comes from bad experience! Half of elk hunting is knowing what NOT to do! Edited by - ELKampMaster on 12/22/2002 11:17:23 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
kodiakhuntmaster, you forgot "bater", which sounds like about the only thing you "master". I guess those "kodiak" hogs are the king of beasts round your parts! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
Hey y'all watch this! Edited by - Jedd on 12/22/2002 22:26:19 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
JEDD,
Whoa there! Last I looked this is Kodiak's thread and he is looking for some advice on his next rifle and for the most part that is what he's been getting. Then along comes your post that is little more than a personal attack. I've seen you been jumping in on other threads and attacking what has been said (and getting edited by the Moderator) without offering any wisdom or advice of your own in return. Life gets a little different when its your turn to lay out your best and hopefully constructive ideas for everyone else to pick over and counter. Kind of leaves you a little bit vulernable especially if you havn't read the whole thread and/or don't think it through before you post it. If you don't like what's been said in a thread, instead of the "attack and dissappear" strategy how about either: (1) leave the thread and don't return if you think it is B.S. or, (2) start another parallel thread with the flavor you prefer (I learned this one the hard way - of course it opens you up for critical review) or (3) lay out a logical and detailed viewpoint to hopefully enrich and alter the thread. Most the Southern hunters I've dealt with (including that Alabama group) have been a pretty hard huntin' bunch. I'm betting you probably got some good stuff to share so how tapping into your relevant experience and substituting that for the personal attack? EKM Good judgment comes from bad experience! Half of elk hunting is knowing what NOT to do! |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Kodiac,
Everyyear I go into a traiing schedule on my shooting, as I let it go for a few months. Then I plink with a 22, then 243 then 308 then my 338. IN general, a 7 mag and a 06 are about the same. 7 a little flatter shooting. If you can handle a 06 you can a 7. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Cain't believe all you fellers usin' 7mm. Thet's a european caliber! This is america, by god. Shouldn't even be allowed to mention them foreign-size bullets, let alone recommend them to american hunters. The good ol' 30'06 was good enuff fer millions of GIs in three wars, an' millions of sportsmen b'sides. Ain't no accident thet's the cartridge all the rest are compared to. Anybody buyin' a first rifle ought to be buyin' a '06. PERIOD! Its the american thing to do.
BJ |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Beaverjack-The proper name for the most common 7mm mag is 7mm rem mag because remington commercialized it.The last I heard remington was an american company so the 7mm rem mag is am american cartridge.
Edited by - stubblejumper on 12/22/2002 21:40:43 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Why consider anything else than the 30-06. Its the best for all big game in North America in my book, I sure do like the Remington 700 bdl and its easy to find shells for anywhere.
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RE: Best all around gun for big game
Kodiak,
Great thread. I, too, would discard the .270 from your lineup of potential do-it-alls, since the bullets it throws may be on the light side for a difficult shot at elk (why limit yourself?). So it's between the '06 and the 7mm. I would choose the '06 for the following reasons. 1) It's easier to shoot. It generates lower recoil and muzzle-blast, while delivering roughly the same power. 2) It's more versatile in terms of bullet weight. With your '06 you can run the gamut between 100-grain chuck-busters and 220-grain grizzly medicine. 3) Don't let anyone tell you that its trajectory is significantly less flat than the 7mm. While on paper the 7 may have a few inches' advantage at 300-350 yards, it is not enough in my opinion to offset the greater ease with which most hunters shoot the '06 (see point 1). In other words, you never will have to pass up a good shot with a 30-06 that you know you COULD have made with a 7mm. While most cartridges, at one time or another, have been called "perfect, all-around numbers", few have been used de facto with the same versatility and success as the 30-06, especially in North America. BTW, my average shot is between 50 and 175 yards - longest shot I ever made was about 250 - all perfectly-adequate ranges for the '06. In friendship, Tom Edited by - .333 Nitro Express on 12/23/2002 15:51:34 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Yeah!!
What 333 nitro said!! Great advice!! How some guys debate an inch or few at long range is humorous. In the field there is about a 99.9% chance it ain't gonna make no difference! |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Ok, 30-06 it is.
What bullets should I use, brand and weight? What brand gun? Savage 111G or remington 700 ADL? And what scope, bushnell or simmons? Jedd, Are you trying to say I've been seeing Miss Palmala Handerson a little too much? :) "Hey ya'll, watch this" |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Anyone ever use a 300 winchester mag? just out of curiosity.
"Hey ya'll, watch this" |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Any 7mm mag would be great. Good luck
Brian |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
The 7mm is faster, but doenst pack the energy the 06 does. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote> Lilhunter I don't mean to pee on your fire but that statement is not correct, or at least for the most part. This info is on the Federal Ammo website. 165gr boattail in both loads(ft-lbs.) -------Muzzle------100yds-------400yds 7mm----3190--------2865---------2050 30-06--3300--------2800---------1660 As I say in every post about this comparison, the 7mm mag has an advantage because it carries its energy down range much better than the 06. Don't want someone buying a rifle based on wrong info. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
I read an article (in Peterson's Hunting Magazine) that explained the advantage the .30-06 had over the 7mm for hunting elk. I can't recall all the technical info, but the sectional density of the .30-06 was better for elk and moose.
Although I would choose the .30-06, they are so close in ability, it's comes down to what you like. I like having wide variety of ammo selection and availability. |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Kodiak, per your earlier post I would recommend the Remington 700 ADL over the Savage - I think you'll do better the next time you trade. Regarding scopes, I would go with Leupold over either Bushnell or Simmons. If you are short on cash go with the cheaper rifle and get the Leupold scope.
In general, regarding the 7Mag vs 3006 for elk discussion: If you hunt elk and you own the 7Mag, then the 7Mag is better. If you hunt elk and you own the 3006, then the 3006 is better. If hunt elk and you own both 7Mag and 3006 AND you own any big bores (300Mag,338,375,416) then I'm betting that come elk season neither the 7Mag nor 3006 will make the trip. Edited by - eagle338 on 01/01/2003 11:47:22 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
Rather be hunting-The numbers that you quote for the 30-06 are for federals high energy loads which develop much more velocity than the standard 30-06 loads.The truth is that they are listed at 3000fps muzzle velocity but that is in a test barrel with a 26" barrel.In hunting rifles with standard barrels they rarely produce those numbers.They are also very finicky and don't shoot well in some rifles.The standard 30-06 load has a muzzle velocity of only 2800 fps which only produces 2872ftlbs at the muzzle.The standard 7mm mag loads produce 2950fps and 3190ft lbs.For comparison sake lets assume that the high energy loads actually produced the listed velocities and energies.Norma does list a 170gr load for the 7mm rem mag that produces a muzzle velocity of 3018fps and an energy of 3439ftlbs.So if you use standard loads for both the 7mm rem mag is faster and does carry more energy.If you use the hottest listed factory loads the 7mm rem mag is faster and again has more energy.These are all values at the muzzle.If you use 300 yard values the 30-06 federal high energy load has 1640fplbs remaining while the norma 7mm load has 1980ftlbs remaining.The 7mm rem mags agvantage at the muzzle grows much greater as the distance increases.As you said one should have all the data when making a comparison.
Edited by - stubblejumper on 01/01/2003 11:59:08 Edited by - stubblejumper on 01/01/2003 12:14:31 Edited by - stubblejumper on 01/01/2003 12:17:47 |
RE: Best all around gun for big game
I own one of each; Savage 110 in '06, and a Ruger 77R in 7-mag. I love 'em both, but I always tend to lug the ol' '06 out in the bush a little more than the 7-mag., probably because she takes the abuse with a smile and keeps on shooting where I want her to! And I can reload a wider assortment of bullet and powder combinations that are available locally in .30 caliber. But I will also say that, in My case, the old '06 has more kick than the 7-mag, but attributed more to the stock configuration and weight than the loads I use.
If I had to stick with one gun only for all game that I hunt, it would be the old '06. |
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