RandyL, I hear you and agree. RedAllison its your type of attitude that just pisses me off.[:@] I live and hunt in Idaho, we have good elk and deer herds here in Idaho, but very few trophy animals. You remind me of a guy I met a few years ago while swimming in some local hot springs near Idaho Falls. He was a bussiness owner from New York, and he was just passing through on his way to yellowstone park to do some snowmobiling. Anyway we started talking hunting & fishing, I told him that I hunted everything that I could hunt in Idaho, but my passion was elk hunting with a bow. He then told me strait out that he was huge elk hunter too, and that not many people were better elk hunters than him because he had killed two record book bulls. He told me that he applied every year for all the trophy states, and he hunts every year because he payed big money to hunt private ranches and indian reservations that have huge bulls, when he doesn't draw a tag. I ask him if he had ever hunted Idaho before, and his reply was no the best elk hunters wouldn't want to waist their time hunting here in Idaho because there were not record book bulls to be shot. I told him that I didn't know that to be a great elk hunter or the best elk hunter that you had to only hunt trophy bulls. I always thought that anybody that punched their elk tag with any elk, every year or almost every other year is canadate for a good elk hunter. I know that made him mad, but I quickly turned around and stroked his ego, saying he must be a good hunter if he killed two B&C bulls. I then (for my fun) asked him for advice on elk calling and tatics. I asked him strait out if he knew how to call in elk. He said yes all good elk huntes know how to call in a bull elk. Well it just so happens that I always have at least a dozen or so elk calls and a bugle tube in my car or truck. I have about tripple that at home but anyway I saw a nervous look on his face when I hoped out of the pool and told him I was going to get my calls so he could help me inprove my elk calling skills. After all he made it clear that he was one of the very best elk hunters, so I thought I could learn someting from him. Now I don't claim to be the best elk caller on earth, there are guys better than me, but I do compeate in elk calling competitions and I am not afraid to show off a little and have some fun. So after I let out a call or two and then handed over a bugel tube and a brand new diaphram (I opened it in front of him so that way he couln't use the excuse of not wanting to get any germs from me) he said "well I actually don't do any of the calling because thats what I pay my guide for". I then asked if his two B&C bulls were killed on guided hunts. I knew that answer of course, but I was have fun making him squirm. I then told him that I though he was a wanabe hunter that needed a guide to have any success, and that he should think about what he is saying before he tells me that because I only elk hunt in my home state of Idaho that I am not or will ever will be a great elk hunter. I know that I made him mad, but I didn't care at the time because I too was mad. He seemed to leave very fast and be on his way. I was a jerk, but I also was trying to express a point to him. I am sure my size helped too with him leaving quickly, I am a teddy bear at heart, and don't have a mean bone in my body. But with being 6'3" 250# people don't see that when I get a little angry. I wish I would have thought of and told him this. If I were to say that I was the greatest or one of the very best golf players in the world and told everyone that I could beat their score. Then go out and pay Tigger Woods to play for me until the 17 hole. Then I would take over and and finish the game with the 18th hole. I of course would beat everyone and claim that I was the best and deserve a award of some sort. Well people would laugh their butts off and tell me that I was a fake. But we as hunters do that all the time, the guide goes out and scouts all year round, he finds the best spots, he know the patterns of the game animals, and knows how big and where the animals are at most times. Then we pay him to hand over this info to us so we can go where he says to go and pull the trigger. I am not trying to diss a guided hunt at all. But for someone to say their the best hunter because they have shot a trophy animal. Or to say I am JEALOUS of someone else, because I have not hunted a trophy area for a trophy animals is just plain stupid. If you go back and look at my past posts, you will see a post on how big is big to you and a elkoholics post and then you might understand that my greatest thrill on earth. One that I look foward too each and every year is to hunt average size bull elk here in my home state of Idaho on my own with a bow in my hand. Yes I would like to harvest a trophy animal, but then again I want to just hunt elk all the time, no matter of the size. They might not be trophy record book bulls as far as B&C goes, but they are trophys to me and I wouldn't change it for the world.