Jashoffa, I understand your argument. For me, I only have experience with a field trail setter and pointer. Our current dog is a AKC goldie who was suppose to come from 'champion hunters' really has no real desire for birds the times I've taken her out but became a great companion dog, very smart who developed a sense of humor.

On checking out the NAVHDA site, the 2004 past results only a handful of pointers and setters. Not really much to go on and not really from the SouthEast. So, again I'm in the same situation since not many from those states do NAVHDA testing. (I think water test turns them off - my setter would have failed it miserably) NAVHDA is great if you're going to do ducks and upland birds but I would much rather do just upland birds.

The setter I owned was from field trail lines but her range was 75'-100' which was perfect for me. She naturally started pointing birds at around 4 or 5 mo. and started quartering the field the first time out. Depending upon the wind, birds within 40'-50' or so she'd find. (she would point birds 10' away sometimes so we would beat the bush around her.) Apparently, Llewelyn's have these characteristics also but was wondering if setters still do. Pointers are too standoff-ish for me and range too far.