from the way it sounds the 45-70 is my better choice, i appeciate all of your replies (except allcamo, gosh hes a pain in the a$$) I do have the dilema of being lefthanded and having trouble finding calibers besides the normal 06,270 7mm stuff that all the manufacturers limit themselves to, it is nearly impossible to get a standard production gun in lefthand in a less than popular caliber, so i decided to go with a lever action and be done with it. thanks again guys!!!