Hey Oldtimr....like I said, the dog (Lab) I hunt with is an all-together different proposition than the one in your avatar. Our flushes tend to be farther out than what I would normally have if I was hunting without a dog. A little extra pop doesn't hurt in that scenario. I am curious, where do you do most of your grouse hunting? Ever hunt northcentral PA (Lycoming County)? That is my stomping grounds now, but I cut my teeth on grouse in western PA.