OK folks I have something to confess. Primos named one of their chokes after me, the tightwad. Let me explain. When I first started sighting the gun in I used regular old #7 dove loads just to get on paper at 20 yards. I then moved back to 40 yards and shot some Winchester 3&1/2", #6s. The patterns were terrible. I did this thinking that the difference between the Winchesters and the Hevy 13 #7s couldn't be that much after doing some post from you all there is a huge difference between the two. I'm going out tomorrow with my Hevi 13s and shoot it again at a much larger target and see what happens. I wonder if I can get more Hevi 13 #7s within a week? I know, I know, I should have known better and sighted in with what I intend to hunt with .