the original reason for this thread was to get opinoins[information] on the NEW pumps now out there. As I first stated, I' m not WHATSOEVER interested in Rem. if anyone has any experience with NEW,I repeat,NEW, pumpguns i.e. Nova,BPS,Win. your comments are very welcome.the reason mossy was mentioned in the first place is because I' m leaning towards buying a 3 1/2" .with it being backbored,ported and offering a variety of chokes, it seems to carry more bang for the buck. the stock spacers and various camo patterns don' t hurt either. whoever wants to carry on with their almost holy rantings about the 870 can check out my new post; shotguns: best,worst and why. sorry to get all the 870 fans all riled, but I did originally state that I' m not at all interested in Rem. I' ve given my reasons so lets move on to other pumpguns please. P.S. it' s been rather entertaining so far.