I tend to believe that a lot of the problems come from velocities out of the proper slot for the particular bullet. Some people like loads suited to the kids and use a bullet suited to a serious load, some just the opposite, thats the main reason I do my own testing. I am man sized and never have paid much attention to recoil so I load the load the gun shoots best and often the best load is not the first one you run into that shoots good if you run the powder ladder and there can be an other surprise about what load shoots best at 200 yds compared to 100yds. Leer