ORIGINAL: spaniel
"There is no doubt that this is one of the most accurate black powder bullet I have ever shot threw my Thompson. But when it comes to the time after the shot on a deer there is no blood trail. Between me and my dad we have shot 3 doe with these bullets and found only one, only cause she dropped in her tracts, the other two ran off into cover. Found hair on both but there was no blood trail."
Gut shot deer don't bleed well with anything except a 20mm cannon round. This is what I mean about these reviews.
If we're going to post reviews let's be fair with what is there:
"This is the first bullet that i used in my muzzleloader and this is the only bullet that i will use in my omega because on the second day of the youth season in ohio i shot a spike at 92 yards with this bullet. The bullet hit
him in the heart and there was
blood on the ground before he could even take a step forward, he only went 30 yards and the e
xit hole was the size of a golf ball."
I highly recomend these Sabots! Ive used them for a couple of years now. I took a 170 lb. 8 point whitetail deer this season, and at 70 yards with a
clean lung shot, he dropped in his tracks, they truly deliver a SHOCKWAVE."
"I would recomend both the 250 & 300 Gr Shockwave Sabots. My son recently bagged a 10pt 180# buck with his T/C Endevor 50/209 using 250 Gr.sabot loaded with 150 gr. 777. It preformed well on a shoulder shot at 50 yards. I recently shot a Doe 120 # at 75 yards using my T/C Encore Pro Hunter 50/209 with 300 Gr.sabot loaded with 150gr Pyrodex. Doudle lung shot the deer went 20 Yards. Great preformance , with
large exit hole. Maine"
For every post claiming they don't expand, there are more indicating they do fine. Overall rating is about the same as for the barnes, 4.2 vs 4.3. Perhaps this comes down to expectations? If you are expecting catastrophic destruction, you will be disappointed. I personally like being able to shoot a deer through some meat and not ruin the entire quarter, but if you feel that is how tough your deer is then by all means I agree a Barnes is a better choice though I have personal experience that prevents me from trusting them.
I
don't want to come across as inflammatory Chap, but have you ever personally shot anything with a SW? Or are these reviews the place you are forming your opinion from? The reason I ask is I am willing to go to the trouble of posting pictures of actual SWs used to take game and even go out and specifically take a shot yesterday missing the shoulder so I could post the results and come here and share that and my experiences on over 50 deer taken with the SW. I'm here to ask questions about it and respond with details. Yet you seem much more convinced by third-hand reviews on Cabelas and Bass Pro Shops where we lack details, know nothing about the skill of the hunter, and can't ask for clarification.
If your mind is made up we can agree to respectfully disagree; I'm just curious what formed such a strong opinion for you, I've only been around here a year so perhaps I lack some history or something.
Your correct on the lets be fair part, you have posted the "good things", I was posting the bad, so folks can make an independent judgement. So really you wanted people to post if they have shot and taken game with the SW---why don't youstart another thread then called "your experiences with taking game with the SW" and let folks post to that, ask what load and powder they were shooting so we get a good comparison. I have not taken game with SWs,but I do feel there are a lot of newbys that read these posts and they look for "confirmation" on their selection, if you see only good things, you will say "I made a good bullet choice", however lets say they are woods shooting with open sights back east here, so 80 yards is max expected shot, then I would recommend another bullet.
I don't want to start another bullet war like last year with on the Powerbelt, because some things get heated and personal and I value everyone's friendship on this board.I honestly value the collective wisdom of the board on all matter regarding MLer shooting, we on the board give our independent collective wisdom on a given subject and it is really great for everyone,also I value your wisdom and experience on the SW, since it is different from mine.
I do know this, my brother for 2 years after I went away from PB, would not listen to me on PBs. I told him to stop shooting the PBat 150g to drop his charge to 2 pelletsor get a different bullet. He like the easy loading and the 150g was the most accurate, and he shot a big buck on the shoulder at about 30 yards. He sent a bunch of hair, skin and bullet fragments to CVA with about 10 packages of Powerbelts and a very angry letter. He asked me for an easy loading bullet, I recommended the Harvester Saber tooth. He likes that bullet. He still shoots 150g of Pyrodex RS in his guns and doesn't change much, he bought 10 packages of 15 of the Harvester bullets, and still shoots them. He won't shoot a saboted bullet because he had to pound one down his bore the first time he tried them. He does shoot PRB in his FL so he knows about "just right tight".
I believe the same thing is true of the SW, you can use them for a long time and have good performance and good results, but then your gonna get a shoot thru the ribs and a small hole thru the lungs and your not going to get the animal. Just like your post with the bonded SW (way too tough for deer), I think the pencil hole thrualso happens with regular SWs when they hit between the ribs on entry, then you got a long trailing job, now add to that shoot in thick cover with a lot of smoke and you got a perfect setup for a non recovered deer. I think that happens to a lot of new MLer shooters who don't know what to expect from a MLer hit.
I like Lee's idea of putting out a "best performance velocity" and yardage range for a given bullet. I think the SW is an excellent long range bullet for the midwest and west and open field shootingbetween 100 and 200 yards. I think they are GREAT then and really nothing beats them on accuracy.
Chap