Actually, I get my best accuracy with regular Harvester short sabots which are not real tight. Theyload about the same as the hph-24's. My second best sabot for accuracy is the regularregular crush rib, and they load even easier than the shorts and hph-24's. I did load some hph-12's a little over a year ago. My notes show that they were "tight loading - require firm two hand push on ramrod", butthe groups were twice the size of the easier loadingHarvesters. I haven't figured out why I need the red crush ribs either, butit may be interesting to play around with them.