Ok GMATT, NC must be somewhat similar to Va. There are no dogs /deer running past the Blue ridge in Va either. I know in the eastern parts of NC dogs are used starting in Oct. Just like here in Va, everything east of the BR mts, it's 3 bucks a year and as many nannys as you want to buy. So, are you in that 4 buck zone? We don't have that in Va that I know of. buck master, you live and hunt where?