i have an old loggy with the metal band and i know its at least14yrs old. i dont use a climbing aid just hug the tree and go so i only carry around 9.5lbs of treestand. i bought a newer one about 2 years ago and my dad got the 2pc one and that rock hard cable around the tree doesnt grip worth anything slips like crazy. i got my wife a gorrila and that is the only stand other then the lone wolf i feel safe when climbing in.