ElkBowDn,
I regret that my selection of rifles scares you, that is not my intent. Also, congratulations on your telepathic powers, interesting how you claim to know what I do and don't need...."

Good imagination! Of all the threads I have read in a while, that one about "big bore magnums being a threat to wounding wildlife" is a "new" angle I have not yet seen nor heard, I'll have to be sure to mention it over on the African board I'm following as I'm sure it will provide a source of endless amusement. The 30-30 discussion has already provided them with a good giggle. Please correct me if I am wrong, but to my knowledge most governments (including our own states) impose a minimum cartridge performance standard, but I am unaware of any maximums -- must be a reason!

As you point out, it is unfortunate that our sport seems to have a never ending supply of folks that see themselves as "prodigy/sniper wannabes" and who think they can ethically take elk at 400, 500, 600 yards and beyond. Regarding your theory that some/most/all folks out there that carry big bores are long range shooters that are stretching the "long end of the kill envelope" I would say, "One has to be careful about applying such generalites to the specifics."

If I were to foolishly attempt to generalize that group, I would be prone to sterotype them as being those infatuated with high velocity-flat shooting cartridges fired by memorized ballistics/wind drift table crazed shooters that spend too much time on the bench rest, but on a hunter to hunter examination of the facts that generalization won't hold up any better than yours.

Now, out of the "generalities" B.S. and on to the specifics of your post regarding my use of the 375HH. My "specifics" are as follows:

338Mag is really one of my favorite rounds all told and the rifles aren't so heavy to carry as a 375HH, however..... My two boys (age 20) after witnessing the previously discussed "cow elk -- classic behind the shoulder shot -- .270 -- no flinch, no limp, run off -- subsequent mile and quarter tracking job" both wanted to move up in cartridge selection. I obliged. The upper end of my rack goes as follows: .270, 30-06, 338Win (2), and 375HH (never mind the 45-70). They left the .270 and .30-06 behind and now use the two 338mags including my old favorite. Buying another (3rd) 338Mag seemed a bit silly, so I simply moved over to the 375HH.

My camp mates gave me a good natured ribbing about the 375HH until opening day at show time that is. I had two elk licenses, two elk came my way, 210 yards, 2 shots, 2 elk down, laid within 30 yards of each other -- Ohhhhhhh Yeahhhhhh! May not long for my old favorite 338 back any more!

Regarding the longest shot I would take is, the answer -- and you'll hate this -- is it depends. A fleeting shot free hand, about 70 yards. A shot sitting, over my knees, (must have got caught in the open) with elk standing 200 yards maybe 250yards. A shot standing bracing off of a nice aspen with good and comfortable footing (my favorite) and elk standing about 300 yards. Sorry to disappoint.

Miscellaneous Odds and Ends:
(1) The longest shot I have taken on anything was an antelope (got him) at a little over 350 yards and that was in my youth, which by your vernacular, I'm sure you can appreciate.
(2) Consider expanding your horizons, being too provincial limits experience -- in other parts of the world, the 375 is little more than mid-caliber. (I loved seattlesetters post regarding 30-30's and most game taken -- how true!)
(3) In discussions such as this one, when one side's supply of "rational arguing ammo" starts running dry the tendency is to reach for hypotheticals, stories, generalizations, 2nd and 3rd hand references and finally when all else fails, jump up and down and rant about how "I got my rights......" (Never mind any rights the elk might deserve) At that point you know the ammo can done went completely dry.
(4) Since it is Super Bowl Sunday lets check the old score board since this thread is late in the fourth quarter:
*** (9) Absolutely No - crobride, kodiak (converted), EKM, Nick, Rather, halcon, BJ, Dreamin, and stickerpt
*** (3) Waffle, But Recommend Against - elknut, robert scott, duffy
*** (3 1/2) Yes/OK/Its Your Right - But No One Current Using A 30-30 -
handloader1, 121553, BowElkDwn, Dart (maybe won't use 30-30: 1/2 pt)
*** (1/2) Yes - Dart (maybe will use 30-30: 1/2 pt)
*** (0) Yes,Yes that's my 30-30 and I currently use it on elk and will again next year (first hand)
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I really don't think overtime is going to be required for this one!

Never undergunned,
EKM

Good judgment comes from bad experience! Half of elk hunting is knowing what NOT to do!

Edited by - ELKampMaster on 01/26/2003 06:58:20

Edited by - ELKampMaster on 01/26/2003 07:42:08

Edited by - ELKampMaster on 01/26/2003 07:58:32

Edited by - ELKampMaster on 01/26/2003 08:07:26