See........thats what I like about this forum,Rob and mobow I thought you guys were going to tear laxdad apart, you know, I use to walk to school uphill in 2 ft of snow uphill both ways,Instead everyone respects the experience of true stalk hunting and is more than willing to accept and learn the old ways. what I mean is, lets face it most of us just hang a treestand and wait.........and it still is a challenge,imagine stalking up on a deer bedded, a mature deer at that. Laxdad, welcome aboard, and I am looking forward to hearing more of your experiences.