I killed an 8 pointer in the archery season,and a doe in the rifle season.I do the majority of my rifle hunting out of state.I hunted 3a and 3c.I saw plenty of deer during the archery season.I saw 9 different bucks in only six times on stand.In the rifle season I likely would have been better off hunting my archery spots.I hunted quite high the few times I got out rifle hunting.I was at a local taxidermist last night and he had a couple of darn nice deer that had been killed in 3a and 3c.As likely all of you do I know some excellent dedicated hunters who had miserable seasons.There is no question the deer numbers are way down.I am in favor of the antler restrictions but I believe we need to eliminate the management permits for a while to allow them to build up their numbers.