Thanks for the info. I think i'm going to get the 870 because one of the stores in the area has it on sale for $239
great choice, even though i have nothing bad to say about the other pump guns, bennelli, mossberg, or the browning bps, the 870 is for sure a time proven design, if you want a new gun i'd go the route you mentioned, if it does not matter, these gun can be bought very reasonable, i bought an old wingmaster 12ga. for 25$ once, the guy told me it "worked". when i started to walk off with the gun the guy says "hey, just wanted to let you know, that gun, yes i told you it works, but i want to tell you something before you leave with it. sometimes it fires as soon as you pull the trigger other times it may go off in 3-5 seconds." i thanked the guy for telling me the truth and told him it probably just needed a good cleaning, well i field stipped it right in front of him, there was a piece of straw in the pork-chop (the hammer) took it out, gun shot fine, sold it for 100, it was an older gun with a 28" modified choke non-vent rib barrel w/o screw in chokes, but a great gun, that was in the early 80's that guy is still using that 870