Sorry for the confusion guys!! Click on the url for coasttrading, when their screen comes up, click on the bottom left "factory re-newed" The cams I'm talking about should be the top one one the next screen, btw: they are out of the next one down for $6o something. The test site is interesting reading, and I can't find these models on the Stealthcam site, so they are probably a year or so older models. What trips my trigger is the fact I can view my pics right on the cam on the tree for under $100 Dan