Mtair - How are you "saving" them by getting a permit and not shooting them? Do you "call in" your permits as filled? - If not then Maybe the DEC just thinks you are a lousy hunter.

My point is the same as I made to stretchhunts - YOU do not know how the DEC uses the numbers of deer harvested (or not harvested - or the percentage).Maybe they don't even consider whether you took a deer or not.

One thing I can say about Doe permits - is that the DEC uses Population counts (out of season),weather conditions at fawn drop, and predator populations - as much or more than harvest results. Also meat cutter checks, or surveys - in the determination of how much of the herd can be harvested - and ultimately the number of permits issued.

If the DECthinks that 8000 Antlerless deer can be harvested in a WMU - its because they've done their analysis. Maybe they issue 20,000 permits to take these 8000 deer. Next year they will check the populations using surveys, harvest totals etc against their predicted populations - and come up with a NEW number. It may or may not matter one lick - that you let every doe pass that you see.

Why not let them dotheir job, and even harvest a Doe if legal? If they say its OK - then really - it probably is. If not - and you take one anyhow, they will compensate the next year or two.

In the Catskills, (and elsewhere) the habitat can only supprt SO MANY deer - and when that number is approached - the DEC Checks it back quickly -

I think in General - people have come to expect 30-40 deer per square mile. In so many places in NY - these numbers are not feasible without habitat control that favours deer - Forever Wild is NOT a habitat control option that does.

FH