Its so nice to talk to some people that actually understand the benefits of QDM. I kinda disagree with the young kids thing though. Why not teach that kid from day 1 of his/her hunting carreer to practice QDM and herd management. Also, after a couple years of QDM, the young kids will have good opportunities for nice bucks so shooting that fork or spike won't even be an issue. I completely agree that state land is a huge problem with the harvest. The area that we used to hunt was covered in people surrounding our land and every buck that left the perimiter was shot so big bucks were very seldom seen. Now, we have a pretty good setup with lots of land, but the a**hole on the other end of us has decided to be a real pr*ick this year. We are separated by 800 acres and he has decided to post two of his guys about 100 yard from our property line. He is also a trespasser so I think we are going to put up a camera and try to catch him in the act. He guards his property like its the alamo, but coming onto someone elses property is perfectly fine, and he's stupid about it too, driving his 4-wheeler in the mud and leaving tracks. This guy isn't at all interested in doing any kind of management but between the state land, that only we have access to, and the 700 acres between us, that's 1500 acres of prime forest so I know that we could get some real pigs on it, but that's not going to happen without mandates from the DNR and stiff penalties for breaking the laws. Michigan needs to get with the times and see what other states are doing, PA is a great example. Alot of guys are bitching about it, but they are also seeing bigger bodies and racks than ever. I wonder what it will take to get it done in MI? Good luck on the opener gentlemen, lots of snow coming up by me! I can't wait!!! Hopefully there will be pics to post soon.