Wow 13 guys! That is a lot of hunters to be in one area. Thats to bad about your hunt. And No not all outfitters are like this, however I think a lot are, I have been on about 8 guided hunts now 3 with various outfits in WY and CO and then I met a younger man in NM that I have used for my last 5 guided hunts I will never use anyone else unless I just want to hunt somewhere besides NM. I have killed a several P&Y trophys, elk, mule deer, and a huge antelope, due to his expert guiding and more important is scouting knowledge. They are a very small business which helps them a lot, no more than 4 hunters at once. Very good archery hunters, thats important! I am not going to mention a name over the internet without his permesion but if someone would like there contact info. please email me at [email protected] I promice this outfitt won't let anyone down the only problem is they usally are booked years in advance.