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-   -   Den trees ***Pic Added**** (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/wildlife-management-food-plots/233550-den-trees-pic-added.html)

Robertesq1 02-19-2008 06:33 PM

Den trees ***Pic Added****
 
My new project is promoting den trees... Trees with hollow centers which provide nesting and dens for wildlife. When I am on my property and notice a tree with dead wood in exposed areas, either from disease, a broken branch, a wood pecker attackor other reason, I take a chain saw and hollow out an area for the process to begin. Some of the "dens" I have made are pretty usable right away and are, in fact,being used right away...

Advantages: bio diversity and an increase in the game carrying capacity of my land. If I notice squirrel nest, I know that particular area is in need and I look for a candidate....

EDIED TO ADD:

Here's a pic I took over the weekend of some of my handy work.

If you look closely, you can see this tree had exposed dead wood. I took the chainsaw and hollowed out a space (den) the size of a football but left the opening only a few inches. I look forward to seeing what happens this year.


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l129/Robertesq1/IMG_0562.jpg

farm hunter 02-19-2008 10:33 PM

RE: Den trees
 
Den trees are awesome - with "snag trees" in general being KEY in the biodiversity of a mature woodland. Lots of guys think they should cut all the "dead" or "sickly" wood for firewood - when the opposite may actually be true if you care about promoting biodiversity on your property - Which you should, by the way!

For the uninitiated - consider - that our Woodlands have been evolving for Millions of years - and basically we - humans have only been able to seriously impact this biomein the last 500 years or so. Generally speaking - Whole species of animals, insects and plant growth are dependent on the the death and decomposition of trees in a woodland environment. When we harvest and otherwise restrict the natural replacement of trees in our woodlands - we directly threaten the existence of many species of flora/fauna - and as a resultlower the biodiversity of our woodland.

So - to get off my little soapbox - if we care about a woodlands and appreciate all the species that evolved to be there - we could/should promote a natural succession on at least some of our woodlands -

Kudos to you Robertesq1! I like your initiative!

FH



Slapout_hunter1202 02-20-2008 07:43 AM

RE: Den trees
 
That's really cool. I think that would be a great addition to my land. How do you make these dens exactly? I know you use a chainsaw like you said, but where at?

Lanse couche couche 02-20-2008 10:37 AM

RE: Den trees
 
If you have a dead tree that is standing but too small for dens, you can also cut them up to help make brush piles.It is amazing how much game a couple of really big brushpiles can support and it provides safe haven if you have too many predators in the area.

Robertesq1 02-20-2008 08:03 PM

RE: Den trees
 

ORIGINAL: Slapout_hunter1202

That's really cool. I think that would be a great addition to my land. How do you make these dens exactly? I know you use a chainsaw like you said, but where at?
Ok.... When I am on my land I look for trees that have open cavities or bark missing and wood exposed. If upon inspection, the tree is not hollow or already a den tree (you can tell if animals are already using it by wear, or the presence of nesting materials, nut or acorn hulls etc or by the size of the hollow).

If the decay is in just in the begining stages or the exterior of the tree, you can use a chainsaw to plunge cut (using the nose of the saw to hollow out areas of the tree) creating a usable den area in the tree (but keeping the entrance limited in size) and thus opening it up for immediate shelter and alsoto insure orpromotefurther decay and expansion by wildlife. It takes some time and is dangerous if you are not skilled with a saw. Depending on the size of the tree, I try not to cut an opening which will affect it's structural intergrity. I use the saw to hollow out an area which becomes a pocket or cavity in the tree. Sometimes it is at the base of the tree or other times it might be at the height of a branch that broke off and left a wound.

It seems certain trees are more "den suitable" like cherrys, oaks and nut trees or hard woods.

I also take the oppourtunity when I am thinning trees (cutting trees that are competing with mast producing trees or apples that I am releasing) to create brush piles for wildlife. I purchase the terra cotta "chimney flues" which are 8 inches by 12 wide and 30 inches long and place two in the center of the pile and then cover them with the logs and then branches (diminishing in size)from the cut trees to create brush piles with solid dens in the center. I try and place these piles under tree cover and not in the open so that the animals seeking shelter are not prey to hawks etc. I thenfertilize the area (with an organic like Plan-tone) and plant honey suckle or other vine type plants (rasberry or black berry) to create a living and food producing brush pile/shelter.

There is nothing more satisfying than seeing rabbits in an area that was barren before your work.....

BTW Farmhunter I have always noticed your posts here and find them a inspiration for my efforts on my NY property.

DanM3029 02-21-2008 05:23 AM

RE: Den trees
 
When we had our property logged, we did it with the long range goal of wildlife habitat improvement, as well as opening the canopy for future growth (and future logging) of the trees that were competing for sunlight. We had our forester run the land, and he pointed out specific trees for "girdling" to make den trees. Basically, he found some big, dying trees or trees with little economic value and had the logger make 2 rings around the trees, about 2 to 3 inches deep, and a couple of niches apart, that would kill the tree, but let it remain standing. This was done about 10 years ago. I have seen pileated woodpeckers and owls in the trees. Also, we lef tthe tops of the trees for brush piles. e also have a 'safe haven' for the deer, about 10 ares in size, that is extremely thick. We do not hunt this spot as this is where the deer go to bed. In winter, we grab discarded christmas trees and make brush piles in the 'safe have' with them. Multiflora rose is prevalent in the area, as well as sumac and other dense brush. The area is now quite thick and the home to numberous deer, rabbits and other small game.

Robertesq1 02-21-2008 06:21 AM

RE: Den trees
 

ORIGINAL: DanM3029

When we had our property logged, we did it with the long range goal of wildlife habitat improvement, as well as opening the canopy for future growth (and future logging) of the trees that were competing for sunlight. We had our forester run the land, and he pointed out specific trees for "girdling" to make den trees. Basically, he found some big, dying trees or trees with little economic value and had the logger make 2 rings around the trees, about 2 to 3 inches deep, and a couple of niches apart, that would kill the tree, but let it remain standing. This was done about 10 years ago. I have seen pileated woodpeckers and owls in the trees. Also, we lef tthe tops of the trees for brush piles. e also have a 'safe haven' for the deer, about 10 ares in size, that is extremely thick. We do not hunt this spot as this is where the deer go to bed. In winter, we grab discarded christmas trees and make brush piles in the 'safe have' with them. Multiflora rose is prevalent in the area, as well as sumac and other dense brush. The area is now quite thick and the home to numberous deer, rabbits and other small game.
Sounds like a very effective management stratagy. I have many snags.. dead trees which provide food and sometimes shelter or dens. However my den tree stratagy is not to girdle and kill the tree (hopefully), rather open it up so that it provides a den that lasts years as a living tree.

Slapout_hunter1202 02-21-2008 08:08 AM

RE: Den trees
 
It sounds good. I'll have to look into doing something like this.

Robertesq1 03-02-2008 05:19 PM

RE: Den trees
 
Here's a pic I took over the weekend of some of my handy work.

If you look closely, you can see this tree had exposed dead wood. I took the chainsaw and hollowed out a space (den) the size of a football but left the opening only a few inches. I look forward to seeing what happens this year.


http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l129/Robertesq1/IMG_0562.jpg

USFWC 03-02-2008 07:33 PM

RE: Den trees
 
...just remember that everything you do has benefits and consequences. It's a very good thing to have biodiversity, but this will do more than just increase the abundance of squirrels and some non-game species. It will also reduce forest health and increase the number of predators that prey upon the eggs of gallinaceous birds such as quail and turkeys. It's a trade-off and you must decide what your ultimate goals are before performing an action like this then make an allowance for exactly how much effect this could have based on the current trends toward your main objectives.

...not a criticism of what you're doing, by the way, Robertesq1...just pointing that out so everyone makes the connection on the trade-offs associated with it...I think you're doing much good for some of the critters.

Robertesq1 03-02-2008 09:21 PM

RE: Den trees
 

ORIGINAL: USFWC

...just remember that everything you do has benefits and consequences. It's a very good thing to have biodiversity, but this will do more than just increase the abundance of squirrels and some non-game species. It will also reduce forest health and increase the number of predators that prey upon the eggs of gallinaceous birds such as quail and turkeys. It's a trade-off and you must decide what your ultimate goals are before performing an action like this then make an allowance for exactly how much effect this could have based on the current trends toward your main objectives.

...not a criticism of what you're doing, by the way, Robertesq1...just pointing that out so everyone makes the connection on the trade-offs associated with it...I think you're doing much good for some of the critters.
You make a good point... and I am interested in your comments. Certainly if you are looking at logging land or timber value, cutting or encouraging den tree or even wolf trees is going to affect the monies you seek from wood sales.I have proceeded modestly, increasingdens at a rate of 1 or 2 per 10 acres and I am trying to focus on trees which are already marginal mast value and in poor health due to the presence of disease. Bio diversity and increased denning capacity are not everyones' goals.However,every land management treatese I have read strongly encourage either saving den trees when logging land, helping the den tree process along (as have I) and leaving snags or girdling poor value trees all in an effort to improve the carrying capacity of the environment.

I have never read any negatives regarding this process and am interested in whatyour specific concerns entail. What pernicious speciesdo you believethese small dens might engourage??

falcon 03-03-2008 05:21 AM

RE: Den trees
 
"It is amazing how much game a couple of really big brushpiles can support and it provides safe haven if you have too many predators in the area."

Quail and rabbits love brush piles.

Rory/MO 03-03-2008 03:55 PM

RE: Den trees
 
thats awesome

USFWC 03-04-2008 05:28 PM

RE: Den trees
 

ORIGINAL: Robertesq1


ORIGINAL: USFWC

...just remember that everything you do has benefits and consequences. It's a very good thing to have biodiversity, but this will do more than just increase the abundance of squirrels and some non-game species. It will also reduce forest health and increase the number of predators that prey upon the eggs of gallinaceous birds such as quail and turkeys. It's a trade-off and you must decide what your ultimate goals are before performing an action like this then make an allowance for exactly how much effect this could have based on the current trends toward your main objectives.

...not a criticism of what you're doing, by the way, Robertesq1...just pointing that out so everyone makes the connection on the trade-offs associated with it...I think you're doing much good for some of the critters.
You make a good point... and I am interested in your comments. Certainly if you are looking at logging land or timber value, cutting or encouraging den tree or even wolf trees is going to affect the monies you seek from wood sales.I have proceeded modestly, increasingdens at a rate of 1 or 2 per 10 acres and I am trying to focus on trees which are already marginal mast value and in poor health due to the presence of disease. Bio diversity and increased denning capacity are not everyones' goals.However,every land management treatese I have read strongly encourage either saving den trees when logging land, helping the den tree process along (as have I) and leaving snags or girdling poor value trees all in an effort to improve the carrying capacity of the environment.

I have never read any negatives regarding this process and am interested in whatyour specific concerns entail. What pernicious speciesdo you believethese small dens might engourage??
My specific concerns with the activity are with forest health and with increasing predation rates. At the level in which you are introducing these den trees, it is negligible from both a forest health standpoint and from the standpoint of substantially increasing the number of predators. The critical aspect of ground-nesting bird fecundity is nesting success. This is affected by, among other things, the quality of the nesting site selected and by the frequency of predators such as raccoons and o'possum that will raid and destroy nests at every opportunity. The more of these animals there are, the higher the likelihood of them encounteringthe nests in the area.

A truly 'healthy' forest is one that is a fully-functioning ecosystem...one with predators, prey, healthy trees, a few stressed and dead, standing trees, diseases...one that cycles nutrients through the various producer levels and back into the soils. What you are doing is not a 'negative' as you are increasing the forest's viability for being biodiverse and having a higher species richness. Kudos to you for it. The only time it becomes a 'negative' is when it has significant affect on forest health, reduces species richness, or affects those species which may not be able to compete as well as a result.

farm hunter 03-04-2008 08:06 PM

RE: Den trees
 
Have you seen Pileated Woodpeckers "helping you out" - after you start a den?



I see more and more of them as our woods age.

FH

Robertesq1 03-05-2008 05:53 AM

RE: Den trees
 
Now that's a den tree!


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