New leasing trend for whitetail
10-03-2021, 08:00 AM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,743
again, most all lease's I knew of required the folks leasing to have insurance, this is not really anything new, been going on for a LONG time
and you cannot blame a land owner for wanting to be protected from law suits
hobbies of all sorts are getting harder and harder to do unless you have deeper pockets
just look at how many lakes and streams and such that are all closed now to fishing, , and that happened way back decades ago, and mostly again due to law suit fear of folks getting hurt and suing land owners
same can be said about why so much land was also posted against allowing hunters having access!
or riding dirt bike or??
the point is rather simple
if you want to ensure you have something in the future, you basically have to BUY and own it, to KNOW for sure you will have it for you and your kids and there kdis and so on!
Nothing new here
BUT the flip side of things, and not really sure why so many folks , just DON"T seem to like public land,
There are always going to be public lands for hunting in MOST states, unless, hunter numbers get too low and the anti hunter numbers over power things
this IMO< is a larger worry, that leasing and having to carry ins if you want to lease!
Just look at how much hunting lic sales has dropped in the past decade!
and how few kids today even want to hunt,
the whole world revolves around the mighty dollar, and generations now, are more and more willing to waste money on things with no real return, were in a very disposable world and mind set of far too many, that don't seem to care how long anything last, when they can just BUY more !
Its a shame, as there once was a time, company's took pride in having reputations for long lasting products and having great customer care., or valuing customers!
Them days are long gone,
its now the cheapest they can make things with the most profits, is all that matters, and consumers , seem more than happy buying things they have to replace often and each time at higher and higher prices! or things that don't l;ast long, as long s there CHEAP!
the mind set of you
HAVE TO PAY< TO PLAY< has never been stronger!
all hobbies are again becoming for wealthier folks or folks not scared or just willing to go into debt for play!
just look at how many folks finance everything anymore!
compared to years ago, when folks typically use credit cards for emergency's or when cash buying wasn't possible,
now its the opposite, credit cards for everything, , and cash is almost not even wanted in many businesses, as a fact its NOT even taken these days in many!
GO try and send a package at a UPS shipping center, my way, they WON"T accept cash as payment !
its a changing world out there, maybe its time to buy land, ? as they say, ain;t making any more and its a good investment 99.9% of the time to boot!
and you cannot blame a land owner for wanting to be protected from law suits
hobbies of all sorts are getting harder and harder to do unless you have deeper pockets
just look at how many lakes and streams and such that are all closed now to fishing, , and that happened way back decades ago, and mostly again due to law suit fear of folks getting hurt and suing land owners
same can be said about why so much land was also posted against allowing hunters having access!
or riding dirt bike or??
the point is rather simple
if you want to ensure you have something in the future, you basically have to BUY and own it, to KNOW for sure you will have it for you and your kids and there kdis and so on!
Nothing new here
BUT the flip side of things, and not really sure why so many folks , just DON"T seem to like public land,
There are always going to be public lands for hunting in MOST states, unless, hunter numbers get too low and the anti hunter numbers over power things
this IMO< is a larger worry, that leasing and having to carry ins if you want to lease!
Just look at how much hunting lic sales has dropped in the past decade!
and how few kids today even want to hunt,
the whole world revolves around the mighty dollar, and generations now, are more and more willing to waste money on things with no real return, were in a very disposable world and mind set of far too many, that don't seem to care how long anything last, when they can just BUY more !
Its a shame, as there once was a time, company's took pride in having reputations for long lasting products and having great customer care., or valuing customers!
Them days are long gone,
its now the cheapest they can make things with the most profits, is all that matters, and consumers , seem more than happy buying things they have to replace often and each time at higher and higher prices! or things that don't l;ast long, as long s there CHEAP!
the mind set of you
HAVE TO PAY< TO PLAY< has never been stronger!
all hobbies are again becoming for wealthier folks or folks not scared or just willing to go into debt for play!
just look at how many folks finance everything anymore!
compared to years ago, when folks typically use credit cards for emergency's or when cash buying wasn't possible,
now its the opposite, credit cards for everything, , and cash is almost not even wanted in many businesses, as a fact its NOT even taken these days in many!
GO try and send a package at a UPS shipping center, my way, they WON"T accept cash as payment !
its a changing world out there, maybe its time to buy land, ? as they say, ain;t making any more and its a good investment 99.9% of the time to boot!
10-04-2021, 11:14 AM
#12
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,359
160 acres came up a little south of me. 70%ag field and 30% hardwood.
So about 50ish acres of huntable land.
$6500. It was leased within an hour of it being posted. Or switched over to "pending" anyway.
That's essentially $130/acre.
This really is depressing to me. It really does seem to me that hunting won't exist for my kids. Unless they have deeper pockets than me. Maybe I'm looking at it the wrong way. But it makes me sad.
-Jake
So about 50ish acres of huntable land.
$6500. It was leased within an hour of it being posted. Or switched over to "pending" anyway.
That's essentially $130/acre.
This really is depressing to me. It really does seem to me that hunting won't exist for my kids. Unless they have deeper pockets than me. Maybe I'm looking at it the wrong way. But it makes me sad.
-Jake
I recently reluctantly took to public lands thinking the same as you. How will my kid ever be able to continue hunting?
I was very very wrong and now can't even wrap my head around how stupid I was.
I actually believed I was teaching my daughter how to hunt and woodsmanship the best I could by taking her out on private 200 acre farms and shooting deer when they came by. We still do and enjoying doing that of course and sure we scout and strategize but man have I missed out all these years on public land where I can take my daughter to explore a 3500 acre property with not a single man made food source....I mean looking back how stupid did I have to be to think I couldn't teach my daughter how to hunt there?
I learned this through selfish reasons, I got tired of people insinuating I couldn't do what I do and have the success I have without some kind of advantage so I took to private lands looking to kill a mature buck from the ground with a bow and before I even got that done I had realized what I'd been missing all these years and what I was about to have my daughter never experience. I realized what really gave me a passion for hunting and why I had been kind of losing that passion. It was the wide open adventure of it I had lost, when I was a kid I roamed big woods and huge vast tracks of land, got lost for hours and eventually stumbled my way back home with 3 or 4 squirrels or a story about why I didn't get the big buck I saw and dreams of getting him next time. That is just not happening on a 200 acre private farm.
As season approached this year I found myself daydreaming about that vast public land that just a few years ago I wanted nothing to do with.
Just to clarify I'm not knocking the use of private land at all but I almost guarantee I'm not alone and many who stress about private access of that killer 40 acre property would realize what they have been missing if they got out and explore public hunting lands.
At one point I was going in with like 5 guys who brought friends on a 160 acre property not realizing I was paying good money to hunt land we were pressuring more than the 2000 acre public land up the road.
I learned this through selfish reasons, I got tired of people insinuating I couldn't do what I do and have the success I have without some kind of advantage so I took to private lands looking to kill a mature buck from the ground with a bow and before I even got that done I had realized what I'd been missing all these years and what I was about to have my daughter never experience. I realized what really gave me a passion for hunting and why I had been kind of losing that passion. It was the wide open adventure of it I had lost, when I was a kid I roamed big woods and huge vast tracks of land, got lost for hours and eventually stumbled my way back home with 3 or 4 squirrels or a story about why I didn't get the big buck I saw and dreams of getting him next time. That is just not happening on a 200 acre private farm.
As season approached this year I found myself daydreaming about that vast public land that just a few years ago I wanted nothing to do with.
Just to clarify I'm not knocking the use of private land at all but I almost guarantee I'm not alone and many who stress about private access of that killer 40 acre property would realize what they have been missing if they got out and explore public hunting lands.
At one point I was going in with like 5 guys who brought friends on a 160 acre property not realizing I was paying good money to hunt land we were pressuring more than the 2000 acre public land up the road.
10-04-2021, 11:46 AM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,743
This stuff has been going on in Illinois for 30 years and has only gotten worse. Its really all good until the demand gets way ahead of the supply then things just get stupid.
I recently reluctantly took to public lands thinking the same as you. How will my kid ever be able to continue hunting?
I was very very wrong and now can't even wrap my head around how stupid I was.
I recently reluctantly took to public lands thinking the same as you. How will my kid ever be able to continue hunting?
I was very very wrong and now can't even wrap my head around how stupid I was.
I actually believed I was teaching my daughter how to hunt and woodsmanship the best I could by taking her out on private 200 acre farms and shooting deer when they came by. We still do and enjoying doing that of course and sure we scout and strategize but man have I missed out all these years on public land where I can take my daughter to explore a 3500 acre property with not a single man made food source....I mean looking back how stupid did I have to be to think I couldn't teach my daughter how to hunt there?
I learned this through selfish reasons, I got tired of people insinuating I couldn't do what I do and have the success I have without some kind of advantage so I took to private lands looking to kill a mature buck from the ground with a bow and before I even got that done I had realized what I'd been missing all these years and what I was about to have my daughter never experience. I realized what really gave me a passion for hunting and why I had been kind of losing that passion. It was the wide open adventure of it I had lost, when I was a kid I roamed big woods and huge vast tracks of land, got lost for hours and eventually stumbled my way back home with 3 or 4 squirrels or a story about why I didn't get the big buck I saw and dreams of getting him next time. That is just not happening on a 200 acre private farm.
As season approached this year I found myself daydreaming about that vast public land that just a few years ago I wanted nothing to do with.
Just to clarify I'm not knocking the use of private land at all but I almost guarantee I'm not alone and many who stress about private access of that killer 40 acre property would realize what they have been missing if they got out and explore public hunting lands.
At one point I was going in with like 5 guys who brought friends on a 160 acre property not realizing I was paying good money to hunt land we were pressuring more than the 2000 acre public land up the road.
I learned this through selfish reasons, I got tired of people insinuating I couldn't do what I do and have the success I have without some kind of advantage so I took to private lands looking to kill a mature buck from the ground with a bow and before I even got that done I had realized what I'd been missing all these years and what I was about to have my daughter never experience. I realized what really gave me a passion for hunting and why I had been kind of losing that passion. It was the wide open adventure of it I had lost, when I was a kid I roamed big woods and huge vast tracks of land, got lost for hours and eventually stumbled my way back home with 3 or 4 squirrels or a story about why I didn't get the big buck I saw and dreams of getting him next time. That is just not happening on a 200 acre private farm.
As season approached this year I found myself daydreaming about that vast public land that just a few years ago I wanted nothing to do with.
Just to clarify I'm not knocking the use of private land at all but I almost guarantee I'm not alone and many who stress about private access of that killer 40 acre property would realize what they have been missing if they got out and explore public hunting lands.
At one point I was going in with like 5 guys who brought friends on a 160 acre property not realizing I was paying good money to hunt land we were pressuring more than the 2000 acre public land up the road.
I know for a cat many private land hunters, have very few actual hunting skills, as they have been more or less spoiled, in knowing where food is and deer come every day pretty much on patterns you can learn and use time after time!
I am also not bashing folks with private lands ( have mine)
but I sure know that growing up as I did without access to farms and private lands, made m,e a a much better hunter, once I started hunting farms and private lands, I found things almost too easy, there wasn't the challange in huntinga s there once was for me
at first it was nice , so much less work and all!
, but as time passed I missed the more challenges of hunting more unknown lands of larger acres without dedicated main food source's!
I found myself hunting all over the state and different states going some place new all the time, to challenge myself
and I also enjoyed the NOT knowing what was out there effect of hunting some place new !
I have hunted my share of places where I pretty much knew every bucks in the area of the farm, from running so many camera's and such,
which also took some of the enjoyment out of hunting places, as it was are a NEW buck would show up in season,
I really loved trail camera's when the first came out, it was amazing to see so many things you didn't get to see in day time, and or, just being able to ID< so many bucks, you never seen or ??
But after so many yrs I also found running camera's took away that surprise of the unknown that was there when I was more of a NEW hunter, walking into a huge forested track t of land and just never knowing what you might see!
SO I agree, hunting public lands can have its perks and teach and make you a better hunter
IF one is willing to make the effort to be successful at it!.
this is the hard part
a s having a gun shop for so long and hearing SO many hunters who lost there PRIME PRIVATE Land, going into public lands and crying how they are so terrible ,. when honestly, its more due to they lack the skills to be successful on public lands, cause they were spoiled for yrs on Private lands that had easy hunts!
also why I think many NEW hunters watch TV hunting show, get on public lands and dis like hunting
as them TV hunting shows tend to hunt on prime lands where hunting is FAR easier(and I was part of a hunting video series so I have actual experience here )
Public lands are there for a reason and they should exist for centuries to come, if folks continue to value them
bashing them on forums, isn't ever going to help save them !
Blaming public lands for how SOME Hunters on them act, is like blaming guns for crimes, its NOT the land , its the lack of respect in some humans or maybe lack of being raised properly!
10-04-2021, 12:42 PM
#14
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,230
I grew up hunting elk, pronghorn, mule deer and black bear on public land in CO. So far I have tagged 98 deer, 25 elk, 17 pronghorns and 2 black bear as well as other game. With the exception of about a dozen deer all my game was taken off public land. I even took a whitetail buck off public land here in TX last year.
There is no reason to be afraid to hunt public land.
There is no reason to be afraid to hunt public land.
10-04-2021, 04:07 PM
#16
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,693
p-p-p-p-pub-lic land??? You mean hunt where there's other people? At the same time? Why that's dangerous. You could get lost. Or lose cell reception. 
I mean, those other people could push animals towards you. Or once you hike past where they stopped at a 1/2 mile on the trail, you could find much better animals with less pressure. Or just have a good time knowing you went further than 99% of hunters do.
I mean, those other people could push animals towards you. Or once you hike past where they stopped at a 1/2 mile on the trail, you could find much better animals with less pressure. Or just have a good time knowing you went further than 99% of hunters do.
10-04-2021, 04:14 PM
#17
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 9,230
10-04-2021, 05:52 PM
#18
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Trumbull County, Ohio
Posts: 9,520
I've taken probably about 30-35 public whitetails, as well as an elk, a bear and an antelope. I know the value of public land. I've been almost entirely on public land for gun seasons since 2008 with the exception of a couple deer shot while hunting with friends.
I'll be heading out to a 8k acre chunk tomorrow with a 3 year old strapped on my back (that's big for Ohio) looking for squirrels and scouting for gun season.
This really wasn't about that though.
Maybe I did a poor job of making my point.
As a kid, and probably the same for many of you, most properties locally were open to hunting. We'd join up with the neighbors on the weekends and put on drives, we'd say things like "go ahead, use my stand. I won't be able to hunt until next Friday anyway.", If a neighbor hit a deer and needed to track it not only would they get permission but they'd have a bunch of help to do it.
Farmers used to call my dad and ask if our group was planning on coming out to drive their property because they wanted does shot and they knew if we showed up we'd do it. That has all changed now, and it saddens me that my kids won't get that experience either.
These were not exclusively private farms where no one else hunted. For the most part we let everyone hunt our (small) property and had permission to hunt on allot of everything else locally. But that's all leased up now.
I don't blame the landowners. Between disrespect shown by people to them over the years- ran over gates, cut fences, a shot mule, windows broken out of tractors and barns, etc. And the value they can get by leasing. I totally get it from the landowners side.
I'm just saddened by it. I think it was "better" when we all got together and hunted together and enjoyed the land and the fellowship. We used to host a lunch the first day and the first Saturday at a camp we went to. Some years we had 30 people show up. Now I don't even know who's hunting around us for the most part.
Again, I get it. I don't blame them. Just saddens me. You can't convince me that the present trend is better for the "sport" of hunting than the way things used to be.
I suppose it's all about the antlers as mrbb pointed out earlier in the thread. We had a newer hunter in our group a few years ago. He shot his first buck. A nice little 5 point (legal for that area) as it fed through a creek bottom. He was thrilled. I, and a few others, met him after dark to help drag it out. Neighbor pulled up as we were loading into the truck, got out, looked at it, and said "I had my 8 year old daughter pass that one up three times this year. You guys are an embarrassment to the sport." Got back in his truck and drove away.
I personally don't care. But that new hunter hasn't been back since and you could tell it ruined his experience.
The direction this is all heading saddens me when I think about what it means for my kids and eventually grandkids.
I'm not against chasing big bucks. Or quality deer management and all that. I'm not against a landowner making $$$$. I think everyone should hunt the way they want to and do what makes them happy. But I'm willing to bet that 8 year old daughter would have been thrilled with that Pennsylvania 5 pointer rather than being told to pass it up several times.
-Jake
I'll be heading out to a 8k acre chunk tomorrow with a 3 year old strapped on my back (that's big for Ohio) looking for squirrels and scouting for gun season.
This really wasn't about that though.
Maybe I did a poor job of making my point.
As a kid, and probably the same for many of you, most properties locally were open to hunting. We'd join up with the neighbors on the weekends and put on drives, we'd say things like "go ahead, use my stand. I won't be able to hunt until next Friday anyway.", If a neighbor hit a deer and needed to track it not only would they get permission but they'd have a bunch of help to do it.
Farmers used to call my dad and ask if our group was planning on coming out to drive their property because they wanted does shot and they knew if we showed up we'd do it. That has all changed now, and it saddens me that my kids won't get that experience either.
These were not exclusively private farms where no one else hunted. For the most part we let everyone hunt our (small) property and had permission to hunt on allot of everything else locally. But that's all leased up now.
I don't blame the landowners. Between disrespect shown by people to them over the years- ran over gates, cut fences, a shot mule, windows broken out of tractors and barns, etc. And the value they can get by leasing. I totally get it from the landowners side.
I'm just saddened by it. I think it was "better" when we all got together and hunted together and enjoyed the land and the fellowship. We used to host a lunch the first day and the first Saturday at a camp we went to. Some years we had 30 people show up. Now I don't even know who's hunting around us for the most part.
Again, I get it. I don't blame them. Just saddens me. You can't convince me that the present trend is better for the "sport" of hunting than the way things used to be.
I suppose it's all about the antlers as mrbb pointed out earlier in the thread. We had a newer hunter in our group a few years ago. He shot his first buck. A nice little 5 point (legal for that area) as it fed through a creek bottom. He was thrilled. I, and a few others, met him after dark to help drag it out. Neighbor pulled up as we were loading into the truck, got out, looked at it, and said "I had my 8 year old daughter pass that one up three times this year. You guys are an embarrassment to the sport." Got back in his truck and drove away.
I personally don't care. But that new hunter hasn't been back since and you could tell it ruined his experience.
The direction this is all heading saddens me when I think about what it means for my kids and eventually grandkids.
I'm not against chasing big bucks. Or quality deer management and all that. I'm not against a landowner making $$$$. I think everyone should hunt the way they want to and do what makes them happy. But I'm willing to bet that 8 year old daughter would have been thrilled with that Pennsylvania 5 pointer rather than being told to pass it up several times.
-Jake
10-04-2021, 06:12 PM
#19
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Trumbull County, Ohio
Posts: 9,520
Hard work will always pay off. So I'm not saying that those willing to work harder won't be the ones to get the game. But it's easier now than ever before to "work harder." Many secluded spots from twenty years ago aren't secluded anymore.
-Jake