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223 for deer?

Old 01-14-2011, 11:52 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by BarnesX.308
If you're shooting a 223, you are only taking perfect broadside shots at modest ranges. Sure, if you're hunting in a blind over a bait pile, you can wait for that.

What about that 300lb buck who's quartering-to? Is that little pip-squeak prarie dog bullet going to bust through his shoulder and get through the vitals? Probably not.
Probably end up wounding the deer. A 30-06 would break that deer down.

Yeah, if I'm hunting a bait pile from a blind and I can watch and wait for that picture-perfect shot, sure.

If you call an outfitter in Sascatchewan or Alberta and ask if you should bring the 223, I wonder what they would say.
no, i wouldnt bust through any shoulder..i would drop his but with a neck shot at spine height...thats a no brainer, drop in his tracks, everytime!!
btw..i aint takin a 223 to Saskatchewan..dont think its legal, fer good reason.
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Old 01-14-2011, 11:54 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by BarnesX.308
I think you're dealing with shot placement issues there. The higher the velocity, the more bloodshot meat. A 223 is a high velocity round with light bullets. It's going to ruin meat if it's put in the shoulder. A larger, slower bullet will ruin less.

Geez, what happens to all the meat from deer shot with MLs and shotgun slugs?
true that, they dont know what behind the shoulder is.
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Old 01-14-2011, 04:41 PM
  #43  
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Its better to start a Youth out on a gun that they can handle and shoot accurately,just be sure to use the heaviest bullet allowed in the Rifle!I started out using a 30-06 at a very early age of around 12-13,thats what Dad had and it was all he was going to use so we learned to shoot it!I'm much older now and wanted a Rifle/Gun with less recoil so I opted to buy a Browning .243 Rifle,I shoot 100 grain Hornady Custom bullets and have never lost a Deer yet,this is after shooting about 3-4 Does and 2 nice 8-Point Bucks over the past few years I have owned it....good shot placement in any caliber Gun is going to make the difference in a good clean Ethical Kill!
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Old 01-14-2011, 08:30 PM
  #44  
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I use a .444, end of story (for the deer anyway).
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Old 01-15-2011, 06:10 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by ipscshooter
Maybe you ought to do a little research before claiming the .223 is unethical because the states have decided so... I don't recall the exact numbers, but, I believe there are 43 states that allow the use of rifles for deer hunting and, of those 43 states, 38 of them have decided that the .223 is "ethical"...
Your logic does not follow. Being Legal and Being Ethical are two different animals altogether. If 43 of 50 states made using a slingshot legal for deer, would you then calim that its Ethical?

The .223 is an IMO unethical caliber for Deer Hunting. It lacks power, weight, and retained energy.

The military uses it to wound people, it does that very well. Because, as a previous poster said, a dead man takes 1 man out of the battle while a wounded man take 3 men out of the battle.
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Old 01-15-2011, 07:30 AM
  #46  
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Can anyone support your opinions with scientific data? I have read the words "ethical" and "unethical" too many times in this thread. I do believe a .223 is more than enough to quickly kill a whitetail deer. We are not talking about cape buffalo here. I also don't believe that a .308 is going to help with recovery if you shoot it I the guts.

It is more about the bullet type and retained kinetic energy. I kill deer with a 60# bow with no issues at all. The last one only went 30 feet and expired.
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Old 01-15-2011, 07:49 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by sconnyhunter
Your logic does not follow. Being Legal and Being Ethical are two different animals altogether. If 43 of 50 states made using a slingshot legal for deer, would you then calim that its Ethical?

The .223 is an IMO unethical caliber for Deer Hunting. It lacks power, weight, and retained energy.

The military uses it to wound people, it does that very well. Because, as a previous poster said, a dead man takes 1 man out of the battle while a wounded man take 3 men out of the battle.
The military is also using full metal jackets, any cartridge using a full metal jacket is likely to wound instead of kill unless a head shot is taken, it doesnt matter wether it is a 223 Rem or a 300 RUM. When people use a 223 for hunting they are not using full metal jacket ammo so your logic with the military using to to wound and comparing it to a hunting round with hunting bullets holds no water and absolutely makes no sence. Do you use 308's with full metal jackets to hunt with? NO!, because they will wound a deer rather than kill it just like a 223 will with a full metal jacket.
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Old 01-15-2011, 10:14 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by sconnyhunter
Your logic does not follow. Being Legal and Being Ethical are two different animals altogether. If 43 of 50 states made using a slingshot legal for deer, would you then calim that its Ethical?

The .223 is an IMO unethical caliber for Deer Hunting. It lacks power, weight, and retained energy.

The military uses it to wound people, it does that very well. Because, as a previous poster said, a dead man takes 1 man out of the battle while a wounded man take 3 men out of the battle.
My logic is just fine. YOU are the one tapdancing. YOU said:

It is an ethical question. One that many states have decided for us, by mandating that no caliber smaller than X be used in the pursuit of wild game of a certain species.
I was merely pointing out that you were wrong in suggesting that the ethical question had been decided against the .223 by the states, since the vast majority of them have decided otherwise.

The whole issue about the military using it to wound people is utterly irrelevant nonsense. The military can ONLY use FMJ ammunition. They are not allowed to use bullets designed for game, and there are a number of them that are now designed to give adequate penetration on deer sized game.
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Old 01-15-2011, 02:55 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by neoinarien
Ok, I know this can be a controversial subject. I know some guys say it's nuts when we have other calibers, but many say it's perfectly fine to use 223 as long as you choose the right bullet and are careful about your shots.

So what bullets DO you choose?
I killed a few dozen with a 22-250 back in the 70s and regular 55gr Reminton soft points...When Federal started loading the 60gr Nosler Partitions I picked up a couple of boxes and sighted in a 700 for my brother in 22-250 that he had picked up on trade...His daughter was 12 at the time...

She is now 20 and has killed 12-15 deer with that rifle...All but 2 dropped at the shot and those ran less than 50 yards before dropping...

The 60gr Nosler Partition leaves a hole the size of a quarter when she puts it through the lungs...When she uses the high shoulder shot, they drop...

As she hasn't lost a deer with the round and I can't remember ever losing a deer with the round I decided to call her this evening and tell her that the gun she was using was unethical for deer and she should quit using it...

I appreciate all you knowledgeble gentlemen for educating me on a subject in which I was so ignorant...
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Old 01-15-2011, 04:56 PM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by nchawkeye
I killed a few dozen with a 22-250 back in the 70s and regular 55gr Reminton soft points...When Federal started loading the 60gr Nosler Partitions I picked up a couple of boxes and sighted in a 700 for my brother in 22-250 that he had picked up on trade...His daughter was 12 at the time...

She is now 20 and has killed 12-15 deer with that rifle...All but 2 dropped at the shot and those ran less than 50 yards before dropping...

The 60gr Nosler Partition leaves a hole the size of a quarter when she puts it through the lungs...When she uses the high shoulder shot, they drop...

As she hasn't lost a deer with the round and I can't remember ever losing a deer with the round I decided to call her this evening and tell her that the gun she was using was unethical for deer and she should quit using it...

I appreciate all you knowledgeble gentlemen for educating me on a subject in which I was so ignorant...

haha, nice
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