using real buck pee for scent
 

just wanted to throw this question out there and see what the response is. i was reading my buckmasters tip of the week and it was talking about using fresh deer pee on a scrap and stuff. I agree that fresh is always the best but how long does that stuff last. last year i shot a buck and put his pee in a bottle. i put it in the freezer so that it would be ready for this year. i agree that it will not be fresh but its got to still be better than what you buy in a bottle at wal-mart, right?
did i just waste my time freezin pee or do you think it is worth a try?

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

What you have in the freezer will be a heck of a lot fresher than what you get at most stores. I' ve seen bottles on the shelves in August, and they had to be over a year old. Most deer farmers don' t begin collecting urine until August/September, so anything on the shelf before that is proabably a year old. Then, by the time it gets to the store in September or October it may have been stewing for a month or more.

The best thing to do is buy direct, or bottle your own. There are a lot of companies selling direct over the net.

Come on over to the " T.R.s Tips" forum.

T.R.

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

click--been there, done that, got the t-shirt. And all that DESPITE what I heard in a seminar by CJ Winand.

He stated that the urine " picks up" additional secretions on it' s journey from the bladder, through the ureters and on out of the body that make it more " appealing" to other deer. Straight from the bladder, he said, won' t work . . .but I had to try.

My test wasn' t a true test. I had everything out that evening---numerous tarsals from a couple deer I had just killed. The jar of urine I collected left open at the base of a tree, plus some other stuff. REAL OVERKILL!! [:o][:o]

Sadly, the deer I was after came out at around 4:00pm and was headed right to a good shooting lane when it got a whiff of what must have smelled like a 10,000 deer urinal! One snort and I never saw the deer again!

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

I have found better luck with fresh taken Tarsel Gland and hang it just prior to or during the rut!!! Has worked wonders in the past.;)

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

the tarsal gland is that small black spot just up from the hoof aint it? if not please describe to me what is, and how do you cut those things out and hang them from a tree?

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

Everyone,

The Biblical quote of Click refers to Abraham asking Esau to get him some wild game, and make " an appetizing dish I like..." The game was probably an Ibex or some form of Middle East/African antelope. Esau was sometimes referred to as Seir/Edom because he took up residence near Mt. Seir, and some of his descendants were known as Edomites. It appears that some of the Biblical Hebrews knew how good wild game was.

I' m with Abraham. Go for the wild game.


Gn. 1:26 " ...let them them (man/humans) rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

God gave us the right to do whatever we want with the animals, including manage them, hunt them and eat them.


Click,

Here is an answer to your queston.

The tarsal is on the inside of the back leg, above the hoof but below the large upper joint. Since these glands are in the skin, just cut the skin off around the hair that surrounds the gland, then place the glands in a freezer bag, and keep them in the freezer. Some hunters pound the glands up, or grind them, then use small portions of the gland, skin and hair as a lure. I place mine in an old piece of nylon stocking, and hang it up.

Below is an excerpt from my book Whitetail Addict' s Manual, about whitetail scents, glands and scent organs.

T.R.


Scent Glands and Organs
Deer use pheromones and hormones, or scents, to communicate type of sex, sexual readiness, dominance, direction of travel and possibly fear by: 1. self-impregnation (leaving scent on themselves) and 2. leaving scents on the ground and vegetation, and at the visual and chemical signposts of rubs and scrapes. These scents are so specific that deer have the ability to distinguish the scent of an individual no matter how many other deer are in the area. Glands produce many of these deer scents.

Forehead Glands
The forehead glands are located between the top of the eyes and the antlers. They are most active during the rut. The activity of these glands has been positively correlated with age and probable social status; they are most active in older, dominant bucks. The glands produce an oily substance making the hair appear dark. The oil is transferred to rubbed trees and the overhanging branch at scrapes when the head of the buck comes in contact with the tree; and is used by dominant bucks to advertise their presence to both sexes.

Marking trees and branches with forehead scent is a means of dominance and recognition among bucks. It has been noted that dominant bucks create most rubs, and they rub more often than subdominants. The scent from the forehead glands may be used as a priming pheromone to bring does into estrus; and to synchronize the timing of the rut between bucks and does when it is left in areas used by does.

Pre-orbital Gland
Located in front of the eye, this gland is under muscular control and may be opened by rutting bucks to signal aggressive behavior. Females open this gland when tending fawns. It probably is not rubbed on the overhanging branch at a scrpes, as previously thought.

Nasal Gland
These two almond shaped glands are located inside the nostrils and are probably used to lubricate the nose. They may also be used to leave scent on overhanging branches.

Vomeronasal Organ
This diamond shaped organ is located on the roof of the mouth and serves some of the same purposes as the nose. It is used primarily to analyze urine, possibly while performing the lip curl and sniff, or Flehmen gesture, when a buck curls its upper lip and sucks air into its mouth, so that scents come in contact with the vomeronasal organ. It is usually performed by a buck that is with/trailing an estrus doe. Analysis of urine through the vomeronasal organ may help to synchronize the breeding readiness between bucks and does, and ensure that both sexes are in peak breeding condition at the same time.

Salivary Glands
These glands inside the mouth produce saliva, which contains enzymes to help in digestion. The enzymes in the saliva may contribute to the scent left on the overhanging branch at scrapes, and on rubbed trees when a deer licks or chews the branch or tree.

Interdigital Glands
These glands are located between the hoofs of all four feet of white-tailed deer. The scent is left each time the deer takes a step.; it is also left in large amounts when a deer stamps its foot, and when a buck makes a scrape. Each deer has its own scent, and because some of the compounds in this scent may be present in higher concentrations in mature males (3 1/2+ years), they may alert other deer of the presence of a dominant buck.

Does use this scent to track their fawns, bucks use it to track does. Because scent molecules evaporate at different rates deer can determine which way another deer went by the amount of interdigital scent left behind. The scent from these glands is the primary tracking scent of deer.

Preputial Gland
This gland is located on the inside of the buck' s penal sheath and may be used for lubrication.

Metatarsal Glands
These glands are a light tan colored circle of hair of about 1 2/3 inches in length located on the outside of the hind leg between the toe and the hock, or heel on whitetails. They are not actual glands, because they have no duct. Mule Deer exhibit the largest glands, then the Black-tailed Deer, and then White-tailed Deer. It has been suggested that blacktails open this gland when alarmed to express danger. It is not totally understood in whitetails, but I have seen it flared when two bucks fight.

Tarsal Glands
These true glands appear as a tuft of erectile hairs, measure about 4 inches in diameter, and are located on the inside of the hind leg near the hock. The lactones of these glands are specific, allowing other deer to determine age and sex of the deer leaving the scent. The strong smell of the tarsal gland is caused by the deposit of urine on the deer' s gland during rub-urination. Rub-urination occurs when the deer brings the back legs together and urinates over these glands.

Bucks rub-urinate to display social dominance by marking themselves with the scent, and they determine social ranking by sniffing each other' s tarsal. Does rub-urinate to make it easier for their young to follow them; and possibly to express social status among doe groups. Young animals rub-urinate as a means of self-marking. Part of the function of the scent from this gland may be to act as a warning signal. The scent from this gland is the primary recognition scent of deer.

Urine
Bucks smell estrogen in the urine of females when they are sexually ready to breed. It has been suggested that does smell testosterone and protein levels in buck urine and are able to determine the health of the buck by the smell, which allows them to choose a healthy dominant buck to breed with. The combination of scents left behind during rub-urination at a scrape (urine, testosterone, and tarsal) may serve as priming pheromones to bring female into estrus.

Bucks may form bachelor groups and travel together prior to the rut. They often groom each other’s head/neck region, and know the smell of each other by the forehead, tarsal, metatarsal and interdigital scents. Older bucks exert dominance over subdominants throughout the year by threats; kicking with the foreleg, and attacking with the antlers. When sparring begins in the fall the younger bucks already know which other bucks are dominant and stronger. They also know which dominant used a rub, overhanging branch and scrape by the smell left behind; this eliminates much of the fighting between bucks that might otherwise occur.

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

It' s really simple and it works pretty good in my experiences and this is what how my father taught me to do it (and where).

Take the buck. Field dress being very careful to contain the urine and put urine in bottle. Cut the tarsals off with a very sharp knife (always) while wearing RUBBER GLOVES and put in plastic bag. Now you can hang the tersals, mash em or whatever and the important part is pouring the urine over the tarsals to simulate the buck dripping and rubbing urine on these glands.

I have put a tarsal in the bottle with the urine and used a little sprayer. It works really good, too. (BUT-VERY IMPORTANT! Don' t leave these little highballs sit til next year, you won' t like what you find it has transformed into.I DIDN' T!)

The other important thing is realizing not only WHAT you are doing, but WHY. And most importantly, WHERE!

If your buddy takes a real nice buck and you can get the " goods" great! Take the " goods" to another area where you might be after your buck. When your buck gets a whiff of this " other buck" on his turf........HE' S GONNA BE " PISSED" HIMSELF! And looking for tresspassers! He' ll more than likely recognize this scent from sometime during his own travels. You can' t buy truly " local" urine anywhere.

But it ain' t Chanel #9!

Uncle Matt (in IL)

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

I use a hypodermic needle and syringe to remove the urine from the bladder. This way you don' t contaminate the urine and don' t risk getting any on the meat. Around here most any drug store will sell you the syringe providing you don' t look like a heroine addict. I always keep a few around during deer season.

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

I was surprised to see that some threads I'd been on, from 2003, were still in the database.

Since the T.R.'s Tips Board is no longer active - if you guys have anything I might be able to help you out with, on the biology/behavior or huntint techniques for whitetails, ducks, geese, turkeys or elk - just type the words "Hey T.R. ..." in the SUBJECT line of a new topic - and I'll get here as soon as I know your're looking for me.

Since I will not get notified of NEW Threads - if I don't get back to you - feel free to e-mail me direct at [email protected] - and tell me to get the heck over here - and tell me which board I should be on - or give me the direct link to the thread - and - as always - I'll do what I can to answer you.

I'm here to help - the best I can.


Looking forward to reconnecting with old friends - and making some new friends.

God bless,

T.R. Michels
[email protected]

RE: using real buck pee for scent
 

Maybe its what I eat.. But I have freshened seveeral established scrapes with my secret personal recipe and have had good luck seeing photographing lots of good deer suing these... Maybe we think to much sometimes...

You cannot buy success unless your inside a pen