Questioning Myself in Regard to Son's Hunting Season... Any Advice?
08-31-2009, 09:31 AM
#21
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 3,606
I honestly think too much is made of the hunting aspect, and this is coming from a hunter who raised 3 sons as hunters.
The main focus should not be on whether your son gets to go hunting but on what can be done with his schoolwork. That, IMO, is much more important than anything else in his life now. It is crucial now to point him in the right direction about school.
From what I have read, your son lacks accountability. He does what he wants, when he wants in regards to his schooling and homework.
How would I suggest trying to change that? I would meet early and often with his teachers witn your son present. I would listen to what they have to say as well as your son's response. I would then try to come up with a game plan that everyone can agree with. I plan that would make your son accountable, especially going forward. Follow up sessions would be part of this program as well as a weekly status on his subjects, assignments and workload. Help in some form must also be made available when he struggles.
The focus here is to have your son be more responsible with the help of his parents and teachers. As far as hunting is concerned, I would not put a letter grade as a condition but input from his teachers would be the final say. If he shows he truly is trying and has met the agreed requirements and gets a passing grade from his teachers in his focus and determination, hunting would be part of the reward. That can also be a condition that he must fully understands. No one wants to 'take him out of the woods' but gettting a better handle on school work in the highest priority.
I know it's not easy and I truly wish you and your son the very best!
The main focus should not be on whether your son gets to go hunting but on what can be done with his schoolwork. That, IMO, is much more important than anything else in his life now. It is crucial now to point him in the right direction about school.
From what I have read, your son lacks accountability. He does what he wants, when he wants in regards to his schooling and homework.
How would I suggest trying to change that? I would meet early and often with his teachers witn your son present. I would listen to what they have to say as well as your son's response. I would then try to come up with a game plan that everyone can agree with. I plan that would make your son accountable, especially going forward. Follow up sessions would be part of this program as well as a weekly status on his subjects, assignments and workload. Help in some form must also be made available when he struggles.
The focus here is to have your son be more responsible with the help of his parents and teachers. As far as hunting is concerned, I would not put a letter grade as a condition but input from his teachers would be the final say. If he shows he truly is trying and has met the agreed requirements and gets a passing grade from his teachers in his focus and determination, hunting would be part of the reward. That can also be a condition that he must fully understands. No one wants to 'take him out of the woods' but gettting a better handle on school work in the highest priority.
I know it's not easy and I truly wish you and your son the very best!
Make sure there is not underlying medical issues. It has taken years to get a diagnoses of my sons problem. Turns out we just recently found a genetic abnormality by having a DNA testing.
Also be in constant communication with the school and his teachers. Some are good and others are just there for a pay check. keep asking and pushing for people that truly will help your son.hopefully he gets a teacher that he will relate to and have a good experience , talk to them on the phone regularly ,have meetings, our school system has a way to check statistics and grades on line for a child.I know it is a constant battle but stay with it and the best of luck to you
08-31-2009, 10:02 AM
#22
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Nekoosa Wi USA
Posts: 6,066
I can relate to your son. I was lazy in school as well, but mine came with moving from school to school from being a Navy Brat. One school was ahead one was behind. So I was either behind or ahead and basically did everything twice. So I got bored. Even though my grades werent to par, my father still took me hunting. Its a bonding period in a young mans life. I tell ya what. If I didnt have those times with my dad I dont know what I would do. Hes to the point he cant hunt anymore becasue his knees are so bad. I dropped out the beginning of my senior year of highschool. Do I regret it, yes. Did I get lazier, no. I worked hard, got my HSED and went to college. I now have a great job. Not the job I wanted and not in the field I went to school for but its a job and Im able to support my family. Im not saying that he should quit school. I dont want that for any children. Stay in school. But you may want to think of alternative schooling. Home schooling is always a way to go. The one on one time really works. Have you checked to see if he has ADHD or ADD. From what you describe with his problems it sounds he may have one or the other. My 10 year old has ADD but he does good in school. Im proud of him. I know he tries and he does the best that he can, thats all I expect. Im taking him hunting this year for his first time. Hes been along but has never really shot anything with a gun other than his pellet gun. And when my daughter is ready Ill be taking her too, but its not something I push on either of them. The way I look at it, if you take something thats very important in his life you may regret it later, but hes your son, you make the decission. I wont hold it against you either way. I know youre going to get a ton of different answers on here but only you can decide. Best of luck.
08-31-2009, 10:53 AM
#23
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Belle Plaine, IA
Posts: 110
I just turned 21 and I started hunting when I was 14. Growing up school wasn't a problem for me, but I do remember my dad always said I could only go out hunting with him if I kept my grades up. My life is hunting, so I made damn sure I kept the grades up. I'm now enrolled at the University of Iowa as a Junior studying Mechanical Engineering. I believe everyone needs encouragement through school to do good, and if hunting is what he loves most, I totally agree with you!! I was raised by a hardass and I don't think I turned out too bad; but I will say the time I spend in the timber with my dad is unquestionably the best time we have together.
PS - It's good to see a DAD out there that's concerned...too many "dads" that view their kid as nothing more than a montly payment...
PS - It's good to see a DAD out there that's concerned...too many "dads" that view their kid as nothing more than a montly payment...
08-31-2009, 12:16 PM
#24
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: IL
Posts: 6,575
wait, what's an E? lol, geez I must be getting old.
Ya I'd ask him why he's not doing better?
If a kid goes to class, pays attention, and doesn't have a learning disability, he should be able to get a C without much work.
Is he not going to class? not paying attention/goofing off? other problems? learning disability? other probs, drinking, drugs, etc...? bullying?
One thing I really didn't learn until college, was actually doing a lil work, studying, hw, etc...went a long way, to go from a C to an A usually just meant keeping up on studying/hw by a lil bit, as opposed to not at all...
In college I often thought, man if I worked like this in hs, I'd of graduated with a 4.0
Also summer school? pssh no thanks! it's easier to do something right the first time than twice half azzed...
Ya I'd ask him why he's not doing better?
If a kid goes to class, pays attention, and doesn't have a learning disability, he should be able to get a C without much work.
Is he not going to class? not paying attention/goofing off? other problems? learning disability? other probs, drinking, drugs, etc...? bullying?
One thing I really didn't learn until college, was actually doing a lil work, studying, hw, etc...went a long way, to go from a C to an A usually just meant keeping up on studying/hw by a lil bit, as opposed to not at all...
In college I often thought, man if I worked like this in hs, I'd of graduated with a 4.0
Also summer school? pssh no thanks! it's easier to do something right the first time than twice half azzed...
08-31-2009, 12:26 PM
#25
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 562
There are no drugs involved. Believe me when I tell you that. The friends he has around here <our lil neighborhood> have good values but once he's at school, I can not monitor them as closely but I listen to his stories and if I don't like what I hear, I tell him, maybe it's not a good idea to hang with so&so. KWIM? He does not smoke nore does he sneak my beer.
First, if you have an alarm clock, move close to it so you can "Wake-up." Your kid, it he's like you say, has problems. The fact that you apparently believe everything he tells you is one of them. His "stories" aren't going to be accurate when he tells you. For every parent who thinks their kid does no wrong, there's a kid who knows how to get over on their parents. He's doing it without question.
Second, you haven't brought up one punishment that he's been given other than not hunting. What else has been taken away from him? TV, DVD, Video Games, Cell Phone, Computer, Mall??? Take it all away! He gets a room with a bed and desk. Until his school work is done, he stays there other than to eat. You say he has an IEP, do you keep track of his progress by communicating with his teachers or counselors? I work, as most everyone else does. But, when I can't get to school and there is a problem or I think there is one, I call. You also can call the school and ask about his lesson plans, etc...if they say one thing and he says another, he's lying. If he's lying about school, he's lying about other things. Follow up, get involved, let him know that responsibility increases with age and he can't run away from it.
Sorry if this post sounds like an attack, it isn't meant to be one. It's reality. Reality is hard to deal with, but it's YOUR responsibility to deal with YOUR reality. Your reality right now is a kid you can't control and it's getting worse..especially if his grandmother is backing him rather than you and your decisions. Put your foot down, put it in the door and put it in his ass and maybe he'll take your threats seriously. It's simple, punish him and stick with it no matter how much crying, pouting and whining are involved.
08-31-2009, 02:06 PM
#26
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: grottoes,va.
Posts: 764
has your son's hearing been tested by a professional? i have a daughter that was the same way,come to find out she was born almost deaf in one ear. we got her up front in class and she cruized thru high school . top of her class.
your son needs something get interested in ,soon. i credit a great shop teacher with saving me totally. i coulda turned into a drughead very easily if he hadn't gotten me interested in woodworking and metal fab. stay on your son . i have twin girls ,as soon as they were old enough they went to work,partime in the evenings. school was a must. buy your son a gun, take it apart ,trade a piece for a good grade if you have to. this year if grades are down ,let him go. but only watch,no shooting.
your son needs something get interested in ,soon. i credit a great shop teacher with saving me totally. i coulda turned into a drughead very easily if he hadn't gotten me interested in woodworking and metal fab. stay on your son . i have twin girls ,as soon as they were old enough they went to work,partime in the evenings. school was a must. buy your son a gun, take it apart ,trade a piece for a good grade if you have to. this year if grades are down ,let him go. but only watch,no shooting.
08-31-2009, 03:49 PM
#27
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 235
Beezer,
I'm sure you hear it all the time. A true all blown out dramatization from mommy dearest on how she has the best child ever and my baby would never steal a car and/or do drugs but I will be the last one to tell you my son is an angel. In fact, I just won't do it. He has his flaws and by me posting about his good attributes should in no way be an indication that he's an angel. I could tell you stories but I'll save him the embarrassment.
Here's the thing Beezer. If my son wanted to do drugs, he'd do them and not give two chits on what I want or say. He could try to lie through his teeth but all I have to do is look at him. He starts blabbin the truth... my eyes looking deep into his soul is like truth serum to him. He knows if I find out differently he's in deep chit! If he wanted to experiment with alcohol, he'd do what it took to steal my beer but my supply doesn't go down when I have beer in the fridge. He doesn't even smoke. I live with him, I would know!
He listens to me for the most part until his grandma comes into the picture to give him the world. He's her first born grandson and she'd sell her soul for him. It's not quite what I, as a mother, want for my son. I don't want him to grow up and say, "Well, my MeMe will take care of me... he's said it before. His MEMEMEMEMEMEMEME! She won't be here forever.
Ds is 14 years old. He's never had the cops called on him. He's never run away from our home. I get more lies, deciet and drama from his 12 yr old sister than I do with him. If the cops come a'lookin for him guess what?! You do the crime, YOU do the TIME! What do they learn from mommy bailing them out? NOTHING! Just don't get caught and don't forget Mommy's number if I get too stoned or drunk.
As far as things taken away from him as a consequence of not doing homework and getting bad grades, here it is *this list would also include doing stupid chit you don't have an answer as to why you did it*:
TV
Video Games
Computer
Toys
Telephone
Friends
Grandma
and Hunting with his Pappy <he didn't go last year>
He'll get an Ass whoopin if needed too <I make him get his own belt>
All have been implemented in a 9 week period for maximum effect as I warned him and some have been on their own in some form or another. I have also gone through his room and removed everything but the bed and dressers at times. You want your privledges back, bring your grades up and/or stop doing stupid stuff.
I've tried to work with him and the teachers. You know what I was told? This is Junior High School Ma'am. We aren't dealing with Kindergardners anymore. It's the students' responsibility.
Reality is, Momma can't hold your dick and get you up in the moring for work, shave your hairy face and pack your lunch and send you on your way. Now, his wife may do that but I as his mother won't. He needs to learn responsibility and I can only do so much.
I wish you could ask him if he'll ever skip school again... I can guarrenttee you his answer.
He'll tell you no cuz he got licked with the leather 2x's and made to write 100 times, I will not skip school, no more friend he got caught skipping with and 5 days of in school suspension. Mommy took his ass right back to school as soon as I got him. I was gonna beat his ass at the house before hand but DH says no. You can't beat him. Principal says you can. I told Principal, YOU do it, he said he would but he didn't. I reserved my right as a parent to disapline him once he got home. He needed it! He was a 13 yr old 200lbs snotball of tears as I headed up to his room and told him to pick his belt and assume the position. Sound mean? Thank your stars I ain't your momma.
He loves me though. Tells me he loves me more than dd does. Every night. Before school. When he leaves. After we're done on the phone, even after all the disapline, he still loves me.
I'm sure you hear it all the time. A true all blown out dramatization from mommy dearest on how she has the best child ever and my baby would never steal a car and/or do drugs but I will be the last one to tell you my son is an angel. In fact, I just won't do it. He has his flaws and by me posting about his good attributes should in no way be an indication that he's an angel. I could tell you stories but I'll save him the embarrassment.
Here's the thing Beezer. If my son wanted to do drugs, he'd do them and not give two chits on what I want or say. He could try to lie through his teeth but all I have to do is look at him. He starts blabbin the truth... my eyes looking deep into his soul is like truth serum to him. He knows if I find out differently he's in deep chit! If he wanted to experiment with alcohol, he'd do what it took to steal my beer but my supply doesn't go down when I have beer in the fridge. He doesn't even smoke. I live with him, I would know!
He listens to me for the most part until his grandma comes into the picture to give him the world. He's her first born grandson and she'd sell her soul for him. It's not quite what I, as a mother, want for my son. I don't want him to grow up and say, "Well, my MeMe will take care of me... he's said it before. His MEMEMEMEMEMEMEME! She won't be here forever.
Ds is 14 years old. He's never had the cops called on him. He's never run away from our home. I get more lies, deciet and drama from his 12 yr old sister than I do with him. If the cops come a'lookin for him guess what?! You do the crime, YOU do the TIME! What do they learn from mommy bailing them out? NOTHING! Just don't get caught and don't forget Mommy's number if I get too stoned or drunk.
As far as things taken away from him as a consequence of not doing homework and getting bad grades, here it is *this list would also include doing stupid chit you don't have an answer as to why you did it*:
TV
Video Games
Computer
Toys
Telephone
Friends
Grandma
and Hunting with his Pappy <he didn't go last year>
He'll get an Ass whoopin if needed too <I make him get his own belt>
All have been implemented in a 9 week period for maximum effect as I warned him and some have been on their own in some form or another. I have also gone through his room and removed everything but the bed and dressers at times. You want your privledges back, bring your grades up and/or stop doing stupid stuff.
I've tried to work with him and the teachers. You know what I was told? This is Junior High School Ma'am. We aren't dealing with Kindergardners anymore. It's the students' responsibility.
Reality is, Momma can't hold your dick and get you up in the moring for work, shave your hairy face and pack your lunch and send you on your way. Now, his wife may do that but I as his mother won't. He needs to learn responsibility and I can only do so much.
I wish you could ask him if he'll ever skip school again... I can guarrenttee you his answer.
He'll tell you no cuz he got licked with the leather 2x's and made to write 100 times, I will not skip school, no more friend he got caught skipping with and 5 days of in school suspension. Mommy took his ass right back to school as soon as I got him. I was gonna beat his ass at the house before hand but DH says no. You can't beat him. Principal says you can. I told Principal, YOU do it, he said he would but he didn't. I reserved my right as a parent to disapline him once he got home. He needed it! He was a 13 yr old 200lbs snotball of tears as I headed up to his room and told him to pick his belt and assume the position. Sound mean? Thank your stars I ain't your momma. He loves me though. Tells me he loves me more than dd does. Every night. Before school. When he leaves. After we're done on the phone, even after all the disapline, he still loves me.
08-31-2009, 03:57 PM
#28
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 235
I stuck it out and stuck it to him.
08-31-2009, 04:03 PM
#29
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 235
First, if you have an alarm clock, move close to it so you can "Wake-up." Your kid, it he's like you say, has problems. The fact that you apparently believe everything he tells you is one of them. His "stories" aren't going to be accurate when he tells you. For every parent who thinks their kid does no wrong, there's a kid who knows how to get over on their parents. He's doing it without question. Sometimes, if you just sit back and listen to what your kids say with their friends *when they think you aren't listening* and keep your mouth shut, you'll get the answers you need. I've done it. I've listened in on the phone too. I have to do what I have to do to get the dirt.
Second, you haven't brought up one punishment that he's been given other than not hunting. What else has been taken away from him? TV, DVD, Video Games, Cell Phone, Computer, Mall??? Take it all away! He gets a room with a bed and desk. Until his school work is done, he stays there other than to eat. You say he has an IEP, do you keep track of his progress by communicating with his teachers or counselors? I work, as most everyone else does. But, when I can't get to school and there is a problem or I think there is one, I call. You also can call the school and ask about his lesson plans, etc...if they say one thing and he says another, he's lying. If he's lying about school, he's lying about other things. Follow up, get involved, let him know that responsibility increases with age and he can't run away from it. Please refer to above posts.
Sorry if this post sounds like an attack, it isn't meant to be one. It's reality. Reality is hard to deal with, but it's YOUR responsibility to deal with YOUR reality. Your reality right now is a kid you can't control and it's getting worse..especially if his grandmother is backing him rather than you and your decisions. Put your foot down, put it in the door and put it in his ass and maybe he'll take your threats seriously. It's simple, punish him and stick with it no matter how much crying, pouting and whining are involved.
Second, you haven't brought up one punishment that he's been given other than not hunting. What else has been taken away from him? TV, DVD, Video Games, Cell Phone, Computer, Mall??? Take it all away! He gets a room with a bed and desk. Until his school work is done, he stays there other than to eat. You say he has an IEP, do you keep track of his progress by communicating with his teachers or counselors? I work, as most everyone else does. But, when I can't get to school and there is a problem or I think there is one, I call. You also can call the school and ask about his lesson plans, etc...if they say one thing and he says another, he's lying. If he's lying about school, he's lying about other things. Follow up, get involved, let him know that responsibility increases with age and he can't run away from it. Please refer to above posts.
Sorry if this post sounds like an attack, it isn't meant to be one. It's reality. Reality is hard to deal with, but it's YOUR responsibility to deal with YOUR reality. Your reality right now is a kid you can't control and it's getting worse..especially if his grandmother is backing him rather than you and your decisions. Put your foot down, put it in the door and put it in his ass and maybe he'll take your threats seriously. It's simple, punish him and stick with it no matter how much crying, pouting and whining are involved.
I believe I'm a good parent. I just have a lazy kid that hates school.
08-31-2009, 04:05 PM
#30
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 235
wait, what's an E? lol, geez I must be getting old.
Ya I'd ask him why he's not doing better?
If a kid goes to class, pays attention, and doesn't have a learning disability, he should be able to get a C without much work.
Is he not going to class? not paying attention/goofing off? other problems? learning disability? other probs, drinking, drugs, etc...? bullying?
One thing I really didn't learn until college, was actually doing a lil work, studying, hw, etc...went a long way, to go from a C to an A usually just meant keeping up on studying/hw by a lil bit, as opposed to not at all...
In college I often thought, man if I worked like this in hs, I'd of graduated with a 4.0
Also summer school? pssh no thanks! it's easier to do something right the first time than twice half azzed...
Ya I'd ask him why he's not doing better?
If a kid goes to class, pays attention, and doesn't have a learning disability, he should be able to get a C without much work.
Is he not going to class? not paying attention/goofing off? other problems? learning disability? other probs, drinking, drugs, etc...? bullying?
One thing I really didn't learn until college, was actually doing a lil work, studying, hw, etc...went a long way, to go from a C to an A usually just meant keeping up on studying/hw by a lil bit, as opposed to not at all...
In college I often thought, man if I worked like this in hs, I'd of graduated with a 4.0
Also summer school? pssh no thanks! it's easier to do something right the first time than twice half azzed...
I agree with you assesment on summer school. Do it the first time so you don't have to do it again!