30-30 And Shoulder Shots
01-03-2009, 09:42 AM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
I have spent countless hours helping people track deer who shot them in teh shoulder. If it exits, good blood trail, but with a 30-30, it might not exit. And then thats when the fun begins tracking. A non exiting shoulder shot will not bleed much if any. I have killed alot of deer with a 30-30, but there was a reason my 30-30 doesn't see much action and sits in the gun cabinet. Just alot of better calibers out there.
Now, I like shooting a 140gr barnes TSX from a7mm-08, and that bullet with that gun will always but always exit.
Now, I like shooting a 140gr barnes TSX from a7mm-08, and that bullet with that gun will always but always exit.
01-03-2009, 10:00 AM
#12
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 316
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
I hunted with a 30-30 again last week, for the first time in 12 years, and shot a doe, which was quartering to me, through the near shoulder, heart, stomach, and far lung. The bullet penetrated about 20" before exiting. When I opened her up, it looked like a bomb went off inside the deer. The damage from my 30-30 was every bit as devastating as strikes from my 7Mag, 30-06, 308 and more traumatic than wounds from my 45-70, 44Mag, Slug, and ML because of the greater velocity.
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
01-03-2009, 10:13 AM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,139
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
ORIGINAL: ths78
I hunted with a 30-30 again last week, for the first time in 12 years, and shot a doe, which was quartering to me, through the near shoulder, heart, stomach, and far lung. The bullet penetrated about 20" before exiting. When I opened her up, it looked like a bomb went off inside the deer. The damage from my 30-30 was every bit as devastating as strikes from my 7Mag, 30-06, 308 and more traumatic than wounds from my 45-70, 44Mag, Slug, and ML because of the greater velocity.
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
I hunted with a 30-30 again last week, for the first time in 12 years, and shot a doe, which was quartering to me, through the near shoulder, heart, stomach, and far lung. The bullet penetrated about 20" before exiting. When I opened her up, it looked like a bomb went off inside the deer. The damage from my 30-30 was every bit as devastating as strikes from my 7Mag, 30-06, 308 and more traumatic than wounds from my 45-70, 44Mag, Slug, and ML because of the greater velocity.
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
01-03-2009, 10:40 AM
#14
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: naper nebraska
Posts: 458
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
i would get him a bolt action rifle. A bolt is more accurate,easier to use,and for a caliber i would like for something like a 243 its accurate will kill a deer easy with a nice exit wound,that or if your looking for less recoil a 223 or 22-250,but idk if there legal there. But when he gets older he might want something bigger then that,so maybe get hime a TC rifle with changable barrel, and you can get one of those in a 30-30,and then change it if you want,and easy to use,safe,accurate and all around a nice gun,and get can get a muzzeloader barrel too and hunt that season also.
01-03-2009, 11:32 AM
#15
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: South Mississippi
Posts: 5,233
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
It seems strange to see folk describe the Marlin lever as "awkward". To me it is nothing but user friendly. I personally find it awkward chambering a second round with my bolt actions. I can count on one finger tho the number of times that I've had to shoot multiple times.
All that said however, even tho I own several Marlin levers it was'nt the first rifle I put in my sons hands as a deer rifle. I had a single shot o6 that I gave him. I believe that for a youngsters first rifle the simpler the better.
I personally quit taking shoulder shots when I started grinding my own meat as there is a lot of good quality meat that is bloodshot with a shoulder shot. I shoot for heart or lung and rarely a head shot on a doe.
I did hunt for yrs with an 06 and a 270 and it's a funny thing about penetration as I have made a couple of shoulder shots with the 06 that did'nt have an exit wound. On the other hand I have had the same round go all the way thru a hogs head and kill the hog beside it also.
All that said however, even tho I own several Marlin levers it was'nt the first rifle I put in my sons hands as a deer rifle. I had a single shot o6 that I gave him. I believe that for a youngsters first rifle the simpler the better.
I personally quit taking shoulder shots when I started grinding my own meat as there is a lot of good quality meat that is bloodshot with a shoulder shot. I shoot for heart or lung and rarely a head shot on a doe.
I did hunt for yrs with an 06 and a 270 and it's a funny thing about penetration as I have made a couple of shoulder shots with the 06 that did'nt have an exit wound. On the other hand I have had the same round go all the way thru a hogs head and kill the hog beside it also.
01-03-2009, 11:51 AM
#16
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Slapout, Alabama
Posts: 227
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
Me and one of my buddys brought a guy hunting with us last season. He used a 30-30 in the woods. He shot a deer at reasonable range in the shoulder. We found a great blood trail and even shoulder bone and never found that deer. I dont know if it was just a low shot and didnt hit much or what happened, but thats the only time I've ever been around a 30-30 while hunting.
01-03-2009, 02:54 PM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Southeast Alabama
Posts: 1,625
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
ORIGINAL: magicman54494
This is why I wouldn't give an 8 year old a 30-30. Then if he wears gloves it will make this task extremely tough. I started with a 30-30 and I was 12. We added an attachment so I could get a better grip on the hammer. I would suggest having your little guy try one before you buy one. Other than that the 30-30 should be enough gun to get the job done.
ORIGINAL: ths78
I hunted with a 30-30 again last week, for the first time in 12 years, and shot a doe, which was quartering to me, through the near shoulder, heart, stomach, and far lung. The bullet penetrated about 20" before exiting. When I opened her up, it looked like a bomb went off inside the deer. The damage from my 30-30 was every bit as devastating as strikes from my 7Mag, 30-06, 308 and more traumatic than wounds from my 45-70, 44Mag, Slug, and ML because of the greater velocity.
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
I hunted with a 30-30 again last week, for the first time in 12 years, and shot a doe, which was quartering to me, through the near shoulder, heart, stomach, and far lung. The bullet penetrated about 20" before exiting. When I opened her up, it looked like a bomb went off inside the deer. The damage from my 30-30 was every bit as devastating as strikes from my 7Mag, 30-06, 308 and more traumatic than wounds from my 45-70, 44Mag, Slug, and ML because of the greater velocity.
I used a 170 gr Federal Soft Point, but have experienced similar wounds from the 170 gr corelokt as well. I prefer 170 grain bullets over 150s, but that's just for the added penetration. 150s seem to shock the deer better, with more Bang-Drops, but don't always exit.
My problem with 30-30s is that don't leave large exit wounds, like more powerful rifles. I do believe that they deliver as much energy on target as other soft points from 270/308/7Mag/30-06, but that they don't blow through as badly, leaving smaller exit wounds. Deer don't run farther after being shot with a 30-30, they just don't bleed as much externally b/c of the smaller exit wounds.
As far as a beginner's deer rifle, I think that a 30-30 is great! That's what my grandpa used, my uncle used, my dad used, my brother's used, and I used. At the same time, there are other, equally-good, if not better, rifles/calibers available. I think lever actions are safer than cross-bolt safety's b/c it's harder to accidentally cock a lever than it is to accidentally knock the safety off. I do though, that that your son should practice placing the lever in safety/half-cocked position about 100 times before doing it with live ammo. He needs to know how strong the hammer's spring is, and how much pressure is necessary to safely lower the it.
All in all, I believe a 30-30/35 Rem with low power scope and soft point bullets makes a great deer rifle for both new and experience hunters. But so does a bolt/pump action in 243, 257, 260, 7mm08, 308 also loaded with soft points and appropriate scope
01-03-2009, 08:07 PM
#19
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Virginia
Posts: 238
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
Thanks so much to all that gave their results on shoulder shot deer with your 30-30 rifle.More than likely I will get him a Marlin in 30-30 to start with.I started with one and loved it and wish I never had gotten away from them when I shot a bolt action for about 20 years but some close situations made me go back to the levers for a fast second shot if needed and I know by experience they are sometimes needed.Not to mention in my opionion there is nothing sweeter to carry than a compact lever action and my shots always average only about 50 or 60 yards due to the terrain I always hunt.Also the price of 30-30 shells are only about 15.00 dollars for 20 so my son can practice as much as he wants without breaking the bank.He now shoots a 410 pump with 3 inch shells and he loves it.He loves to shoot a gun so the price of ammo and knowing him makes me lean this way.As far as safety the new Marlins have the slide safety built in and also the half cock safety so it has 2 safetys.For a long time he will always be beside me when we hunt until I know he is ready to set apart from me.He knows safety is the most important thing as i preach it to him all the time.The rest of January my Saturdays will be spent squirrel hunting with him as he loves going after squirrels.This little boy gets excited playing xbox 360 games and when he shoots a deer or elk always makes me see it and I do as I always try to encourage him.Thanks a lot everybody! Mike
01-03-2009, 09:39 PM
#20
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Cove City, North Carolina
Posts: 256
RE: 30-30 And Shoulder Shots
i have a marlin 336w and it's a nice 3030, except that i think it has more recoil than my 7mmRemMag. but if you teach your son to hold it nice and tight (you know, properly) then he will probably love it. and the shoulder shots will crumple a deer.
