The Great Debate Over Baiting
11-30-2008, 05:52 PM
#61
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location:
Posts: 819
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
When planting a food plot, you are increasing the yield of quality food sources for deer. This will affect them year round basically. The bucks will grow better racks, the does will provide better milk. When you are sitting over a pile of corn, you are not doing the herd any good, just using it to entice them in for a shot. a 20 acre cornfield is a lot haredr to hunt over than a pile of corn from a sack. If you are not picking all the corn up when you are done hunting you will quickly find they are coming in at night to eat it.
Secondly, baiting spreads disease, quickly, which is why it is also frowned upon. Deer feeding nose to nose is a bad mix when you have a cwd issue.
I think baiting has its place, but I would only like to see it where you are dealing with large herds in urban areas that make it difficult to harvest animals safely. I am sure deer shot over bait are not recognized by any of the record keeping organizations, not that it will affect many of us.
Michigan or not, deer have to eat, be it acorns or woody browse at this time of year. If you want to become a better hunter, become a better woods man and study what the deer eat in your area. Ask people that harvested deer in the area what they found in their stomachs. Observe the deer when they are feeding and watch what they eat. Call your local game biologists and ask them what the deer in your area eat.
Secondly, baiting spreads disease, quickly, which is why it is also frowned upon. Deer feeding nose to nose is a bad mix when you have a cwd issue.
I think baiting has its place, but I would only like to see it where you are dealing with large herds in urban areas that make it difficult to harvest animals safely. I am sure deer shot over bait are not recognized by any of the record keeping organizations, not that it will affect many of us.
Michigan or not, deer have to eat, be it acorns or woody browse at this time of year. If you want to become a better hunter, become a better woods man and study what the deer eat in your area. Ask people that harvested deer in the area what they found in their stomachs. Observe the deer when they are feeding and watch what they eat. Call your local game biologists and ask them what the deer in your area eat.
11-30-2008, 05:54 PM
#62
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: elmira ny
Posts: 1,676
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
ORIGINAL: zrexpilot
There are sportsmen and there are hunters.
It seem sportsmen feel the need to give the deer a chance, like either using a bow or a muzzle loader or not hunting over bait etc etc. Like its some kind of game.
A true hunters sole objective is to kill a deer for food, he doesnt feel the need to give a deer a chance.
While both probably feel the whole atmoshpere is quite rewarding, the camping, the fellowship amongs other hunters, the campfires, the stories around them, being in the woods.
A sportsman will hold out for big bucks as he doesnt get the enjoyment out of shooting smaller bucks. A hunter will kill smaller bucks and gets enjoyment out of it, a big buck is a bonus, his sole objective is food. Hunters proccess there own deer, they make sausage, jerky, dried sasage etc etc etc . Spotsman have there deer proccesed.
nothing wrong with being either, we all enjoy the same thing, some just feel different about how we get there.
Then you have the lazy slobs, but thats another topic.
There are sportsmen and there are hunters.
It seem sportsmen feel the need to give the deer a chance, like either using a bow or a muzzle loader or not hunting over bait etc etc. Like its some kind of game.
A true hunters sole objective is to kill a deer for food, he doesnt feel the need to give a deer a chance.
While both probably feel the whole atmoshpere is quite rewarding, the camping, the fellowship amongs other hunters, the campfires, the stories around them, being in the woods.
A sportsman will hold out for big bucks as he doesnt get the enjoyment out of shooting smaller bucks. A hunter will kill smaller bucks and gets enjoyment out of it, a big buck is a bonus, his sole objective is food. Hunters proccess there own deer, they make sausage, jerky, dried sasage etc etc etc . Spotsman have there deer proccesed.
nothing wrong with being either, we all enjoy the same thing, some just feel different about how we get there.
Then you have the lazy slobs, but thats another topic.
Can't, in your own words, a hunter hold out for a big buck? You say that person is a sportsman, not a hunter. What I enjoy most about holding out is the fact that I have just as much of a chance as never firing my weapon in any given season. It isn't because I don't " enjoy " shooting small bucks. I guess if my family relied on the venison to survive, I might think differently. I like stretching my HUNTING as far as possible, and have absolutely no problem ending up with nada. I left the need to judge my season success based on the body count back in the '60's.
As far as my opinion on bait vs. foodplot, it was asked for and I gave it. How is that hypocritical. I don't condone either, but as I have said plenty of times, { apparently it gets glossed over } those who want to use everything that's legal, GO FOR IT! I choose not to. My choice.
11-30-2008, 06:00 PM
#63
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: elmira ny
Posts: 1,676
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
ORIGINAL: needmorecoffee
I have been confused about the whole baiting thing myself.
Question is, if setting out food, salt licks etc is considered baiting and illegal in NY, then why is planting clover crops not considered baiting?It serves the same purpose as the illegal bait practices.
Hunter plants crop in his hunting area, comes back to check on it, tends to it, come hunting time, he sets up next to this crop and maybe takes a deer or two that are feeding in this crop. A month or so later, this crop is now dead due to snow and cold temps. Unsuitable for human eating.
So how is this NOT considered baiting in NYS? Or anywhere else?
I agree with what the other poster has said about scents and lures. Still baiting IMO.
I have been confused about the whole baiting thing myself.
Question is, if setting out food, salt licks etc is considered baiting and illegal in NY, then why is planting clover crops not considered baiting?It serves the same purpose as the illegal bait practices.
Hunter plants crop in his hunting area, comes back to check on it, tends to it, come hunting time, he sets up next to this crop and maybe takes a deer or two that are feeding in this crop. A month or so later, this crop is now dead due to snow and cold temps. Unsuitable for human eating.
So how is this NOT considered baiting in NYS? Or anywhere else?
I agree with what the other poster has said about scents and lures. Still baiting IMO.
I totally agree, and would be more than just a little happy if ALL of it was not allowed. MHO, my preference.
11-30-2008, 06:18 PM
#64
Spike
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Muskogee, OK
Posts: 31
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
i live in oklahoma and "baiting" is legal. i will admit i have a corn feeder with a stand right by it. it is in the middle of a 1 acre food plot. in all my time hunting i have seen more deer when i wasn't hunting at my feeder. don't think for one second that a feeder makes deer hunting easy. deer can still smell and always seem to be way more cautious when in the area close to my feeder. mostly does and small bucks. i would also like to add that i keep a trail cam set on it at all times. since the week after bow season opened there has not been one picture during the day. i keep my feeder full from about the beginning of septenber till about may. it really helps the deer after all the other food is gone. the place i have my feeder is on about 50 acres which is public land. i dont see a problem with it at all. the deer are free to go to the field acrossed the road to eat or the bean field on the other side of the creek. however i dont use any calls or scents while hunting just sit on trails and occasionally my feeder. is all in what you want to do. dont knock someone elses way of doing something if you dont agree. do you want someone telling to how to drive or raise your kids? i think not. im not trying to start anything just saying please respect my beliefs and i will respect yours because we all have different issues to deal with in the area where we hunt. o by the way i killed my first buck this year it was about 400 yards from the food plot.
11-30-2008, 06:38 PM
#65
Spike
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Muskogee, OK
Posts: 31
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
man035
Fork Horn
Posts: 135
Joined: 10/19/2008
From: Sydney, AUS / Miami, OK
Status: online Bait
From Old Norse beita (“‘food’”).
Rhymes: -eɪt
Noun
bait (plural baits)
1. Any substance, especially food, used in catching fish, or other animals, by alluring them to a hook, snare, trap, or net.
2. Anything which allures; a lure; enticement; temptation.
Verb
Infinitive
to bait
Third person singular
baits
Simple past
baited
Past participle
baited
Present participle
baiting
to bait (third-person singular simple present baits, present participle baiting, simple past and past participle baited)
1. To attract fish or other animals in order to catch them.
Fork Horn
Posts: 135
Joined: 10/19/2008
From: Sydney, AUS / Miami, OK
Status: online Bait
From Old Norse beita (“‘food’”).
Rhymes: -eɪt
Noun
bait (plural baits)
1. Any substance, especially food, used in catching fish, or other animals, by alluring them to a hook, snare, trap, or net.
2. Anything which allures; a lure; enticement; temptation.
Verb
Infinitive
to bait
Third person singular
baits
Simple past
baited
Past participle
baited
Present participle
baiting
to bait (third-person singular simple present baits, present participle baiting, simple past and past participle baited)
1. To attract fish or other animals in order to catch them.
ORIGINAL: jayman035
Bait
From Old Norse beita(“‘food’”).
Rhymes: -eɪt
Noun
bait (plural baits)
1. Any substance, especially food, used in catching fish, or other animals, by alluring them to a hook, snare, trap, or net.
2. Anything which allures; a lure; enticement; temptation.
Verb
Infinitive
to bait
Third person singular
baits
Simple past
baited
Past participle
baited
Present participle
baiting
to bait (third-person singular simple present baits, present participle baiting, simple past and past participle baited) [ol][*]To attract fish or other animals in order to catch them.[/ol]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
had a good read, thanks. you bring up a good point
[8D]
Bait
From Old Norse beita(“‘food’”).
Rhymes: -eɪt
Noun
bait (plural baits)
1. Any substance, especially food, used in catching fish, or other animals, by alluring them to a hook, snare, trap, or net.
2. Anything which allures; a lure; enticement; temptation.
Verb
Infinitive
to bait
Third person singular
baits
Simple past
baited
Past participle
baited
Present participle
baiting
to bait (third-person singular simple present baits, present participle baiting, simple past and past participle baited) [ol][*]To attract fish or other animals in order to catch them.[/ol]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
had a good read, thanks. you bring up a good point
[8D]
so i guess we should just use hooks and no worms for fishing???
11-30-2008, 06:50 PM
#66
Spike
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Muskogee, OK
Posts: 31
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
ORIGINAL: WVCritterGitter
To each, his own. We're all different in some ways and alike in others. I do what's legal and feels good for me and I suspect others do the same. That being said, I guess I've killed at least 1 deer by all the methods above and they all tasted the same. I've baited their ears, noses and stomachs......lol. I couldn't say off hand how many I've had come to me after I used the grunt tube. Heck, once I called a buck to me using a doe bleat, shot at it with my bow and missed, and called it back in for a second shot. I baited his ears. A couple years ago, I took a nice 7 pointer using Tinks 69. A fellow down the road from where I was hunting had feeders set up and all the deer were down there. I set out a couple scent bombs using Tinks and within 2 hours I had the buck on the ground. I guess you could say I baited his nose. Several years ago I placed a mineral block on a well traveled deer path at my Dad's farm and once in a while deer would stop by and lick it on their way to their bedding area and this allowed me to get a shot if I so chose. I rekon I baited his stomach. Now if I had a hot doe to tie up or a doe decoy with estrous perfume, I rekon I'd be baiting their eyes too.....Happy hunting everyone......
To each, his own. We're all different in some ways and alike in others. I do what's legal and feels good for me and I suspect others do the same. That being said, I guess I've killed at least 1 deer by all the methods above and they all tasted the same. I've baited their ears, noses and stomachs......lol. I couldn't say off hand how many I've had come to me after I used the grunt tube. Heck, once I called a buck to me using a doe bleat, shot at it with my bow and missed, and called it back in for a second shot. I baited his ears. A couple years ago, I took a nice 7 pointer using Tinks 69. A fellow down the road from where I was hunting had feeders set up and all the deer were down there. I set out a couple scent bombs using Tinks and within 2 hours I had the buck on the ground. I guess you could say I baited his nose. Several years ago I placed a mineral block on a well traveled deer path at my Dad's farm and once in a while deer would stop by and lick it on their way to their bedding area and this allowed me to get a shot if I so chose. I rekon I baited his stomach. Now if I had a hot doe to tie up or a doe decoy with estrous perfume, I rekon I'd be baiting their eyes too.....Happy hunting everyone......
lmao i like this. well said. i hear how easy you all think it is with a feeder. i guess mine stinks or something bc ain't been no big ones there at all on my cam nor anything else during daylight hours for that
11-30-2008, 10:57 PM
#67
Spike
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 39
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
ORIGINAL: Remnard
When planting a food plot, you are increasing the yield of quality food sources for deer. This will affect them year round basically. The bucks will grow better racks, the does will provide better milk. When you are sitting over a pile of corn, you are not doing the herd any good, just using it to entice them in for a shot. a 20 acre cornfield is a lot haredr to hunt over than a pile of corn from a sack. If you are not picking all the corn up when you are done hunting you will quickly find they are coming in at night to eat it.
Secondly, baiting spreads disease, quickly, which is why it is also frowned upon. Deer feeding nose to nose is a bad mix when you have a cwd issue.
I think baiting has its place, but I would only like to see it where you are dealing with large herds in urban areas that make it difficult to harvest animals safely. I am sure deer shot over bait are not recognized by any of the record keeping organizations, not that it will affect many of us.
Michigan or not, deer have to eat, be it acorns or woody browse at this time of year. If you want to become a better hunter, become a better woods man and study what the deer eat in your area. Ask people that harvested deer in the area what they found in their stomachs. Observe the deer when they are feeding and watch what they eat. Call your local game biologists and ask them what the deer in your area eat.
When planting a food plot, you are increasing the yield of quality food sources for deer. This will affect them year round basically. The bucks will grow better racks, the does will provide better milk. When you are sitting over a pile of corn, you are not doing the herd any good, just using it to entice them in for a shot. a 20 acre cornfield is a lot haredr to hunt over than a pile of corn from a sack. If you are not picking all the corn up when you are done hunting you will quickly find they are coming in at night to eat it.
Secondly, baiting spreads disease, quickly, which is why it is also frowned upon. Deer feeding nose to nose is a bad mix when you have a cwd issue.
I think baiting has its place, but I would only like to see it where you are dealing with large herds in urban areas that make it difficult to harvest animals safely. I am sure deer shot over bait are not recognized by any of the record keeping organizations, not that it will affect many of us.
Michigan or not, deer have to eat, be it acorns or woody browse at this time of year. If you want to become a better hunter, become a better woods man and study what the deer eat in your area. Ask people that harvested deer in the area what they found in their stomachs. Observe the deer when they are feeding and watch what they eat. Call your local game biologists and ask them what the deer in your area eat.
Also if baiting(and I'm talking about small bait piles and not some of the huge piles I've seen pictures of) help spread disease then why are man made mineral licks and supplements allowed? Pouring out a gallon of Deer Cain and Buck Jam will concentrate deer just as much as a small pile of corn.
It seems everyone who wants to say food plots are different than baiting keep wanting to talk about huge plots and I have to say once again in my experiance most food plots are an acre or less(generally much less). I would have to agree with those who have said a pile of corn is a plate of food, a food plot is a buffet.
11-30-2008, 11:26 PM
#68
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,139
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
A different thought on baiting.I hunt public land. Some guy comes along and baits a spot. Bait tends to congragate deer. I have a right to hunt that land as well as him but since he put out bait in his mind it has become "his" spot. I love to track deer. I will circle every and all baited areas to try to pick up a track from a deer that he drew to that area. Does that make me a jerk? I know almost every baiter would be angry if I invaded "his" spot. His baiting practice almost forces me to check that area because he altered the local deer feeding and bedding patterns. What do you guy's that bait think of this? Would you think I'm a jerk if I attempt to pick up a track in an area you are baiting? I am not against baiting by the way.
12-01-2008, 03:24 AM
#69
Spike
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Southern Ontario
Posts: 90
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
We ars a little different here in Ont. Canada where baiting is legal, for one, We are only allowed one Buck, and if you win a draw you get a buck or a doe but only one. With our new gun registration seems there are not even enough hunters now to move the deer. We are in apple country and farmers are screaming cause of the deer population. Because you are only allowed one we let most walk anyways. Let a doe walk ten yards infront of me and she never did see me. I figured if I get her now what am I going to do till the end of December. I don't know anyone around here that baits for gun season and as bow hunters we are a different breed of hunters. Kinda like fishing, You have fishermen then you have the ones that only show up for salmon season. Many farmers do notwant gun hunters on there land yet the same farmer will let you bowhunt. I feed the deer all year and I could go to a wild game store and buy a deer cheaper than it costs to feed them for a year. The debate moves on 
I do agree with Goose that deer are more cautious around the feed piles but if you shoot one at your feed pile you not think the deer will stay away? I would not drop one on my feed pile anyways.
I do agree with Goose that deer are more cautious around the feed piles but if you shoot one at your feed pile you not think the deer will stay away? I would not drop one on my feed pile anyways.
12-01-2008, 10:38 AM
#70
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: elmira ny
Posts: 1,676
RE: The Great Debate Over Baiting
ORIGINAL: magicman54494
A different thought on baiting.I hunt public land. Some guy comes along and baits a spot. Bait tends to congragate deer. I have a right to hunt that land as well as him but since he put out bait in his mind it has become "his" spot. I love to track deer. I will circle every and all baited areas to try to pick up a track from a deer that he drew to that area. Does that make me a jerk? I know almost every baiter would be angry if I invaded "his" spot. His baiting practice almost forces me to check that area because he altered the local deer feeding and bedding patterns. What do you guy's that bait think of this? Would you think I'm a jerk if I attempt to pick up a track in an area you are baiting? I am not against baiting by the way.
A different thought on baiting.I hunt public land. Some guy comes along and baits a spot. Bait tends to congragate deer. I have a right to hunt that land as well as him but since he put out bait in his mind it has become "his" spot. I love to track deer. I will circle every and all baited areas to try to pick up a track from a deer that he drew to that area. Does that make me a jerk? I know almost every baiter would be angry if I invaded "his" spot. His baiting practice almost forces me to check that area because he altered the local deer feeding and bedding patterns. What do you guy's that bait think of this? Would you think I'm a jerk if I attempt to pick up a track in an area you are baiting? I am not against baiting by the way.
I thought baiting was allowed only on private property? If so on public land, a baiter suffers the same as someone that leaves a stand on public property. Your taking a gamble. Personally, I would thank the guy that's baiting for his efforts in providing deer to track!
