Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

I am the shooting host on a new TV hunting show called " The Best of the West"

We have a lot of long range shooting of big game on video and will probably run some of it on our show. When I say long range I mean 500 yds - 800yds. All are one-shot kills with most animals dropping immediately to the shot.

What do you guys think about this? I would like your feedback.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

on the outdoor chanel i hope
i' d be interested in watching.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

I,d say droppig an animal at that distance is fine if you are a meat hunter. But at that range it takes all the sport out of it unless your quarry can shoot back if you miss.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

After viewing this video, there may be a lot of wounded animals running off to die.
As the old saying goes, Monkey, Monkey do. and there are a lot of people (I won' t call them hunters) who will try and mimic the shooting that they see. Many don' t realize that it takes a lot of practice, a full knowll;edge of the rifle you are using, and the ballistics knowledge to take these kind of shot. In my case my limit is 300 yds. and I better have a rock solid rest to even attempt that shot. I think that the video should go into what these ' hunters' go through to be able to take these shots. I would like to see the video, but I am aware that I am not capable of doing such shooting.

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I' d say that' s a great shot and takes alot of skill and knowledge of your firearm ect.[8D]
Ever here of the Origanal 1,000Yd Rifle Club In PA, Some of thier members make shot' s like that, from one ridge to another.

:(Jersey, That deer shot at a thousand yards with a high power rifle and the one shot at 30yds with an arrow from a treestand are EXACTLY the same. Obviously niether had any Knowledge they were about to die, both where ambushed.

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I don' t see anything wrong with taking responsible long range shots. There are a lot of avid hunters that are also BR shooters or that simply shoot at long ranges often that would have no trouble sending a high powered round out after game at a half mile (800yrds). I have never taken a shot that long on deer (383yrds was max) but I' ve taken a coyote at almost 470yrds and felt confident that I could have done so at much farther. My grandfather used to hunt coyotes with a lever action .45-70 with iron sights, I once witnessed him make a 650yrd shot on a trotting coyote, an amazing distance on a stationary target, let alone a moving one. If a guy knows his rifle well enough, and his rifle is capable of grouping well, in most high powered cases, accuracy is the limiting factor of the range, not the power of the round. If the event presented itself I would feel comfortable taking a 550-600yrd shot with my .30-06 and never think twice about it.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

The show will start on The Sportsman Channel. This is a new channel dedicated 100% to hunting and fishing. It will be offered free to any sat. or cable company that wants to carry it. Call your TV provider and ask for it.

www.thesportsmanchannel.com

We also are scheduled to start on the Outdoor Channel Jan 2004

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

If you can drop an animal at that distance id say go for it. Just as long as they drop i see no problem in showing it.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

Brokenrack I' m not against the kill but I' d like to see the animal in its beuty that I' m about to harvest. A shot out to 3-400 yds is reasonable at least you can still see the animal with the naked eye, but 800 - a thousand yds thats more than half a mile. wheres the finess to the hunt itself, the outwitting,the cunning,the grace? A shot like that is nothing more than good marksmanship not a good hunt.

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I don' t see anything wrong with that kind of shooting if you can pull it off. With good optics, a steady rest and a good rifle you can see that deer pretty good at 1000 yards. And if you have practiced at that range, then whats the problem? It takes the sport out of it? That seems to be a personal opinion that we all must decide for ourselves. Some people say using a rifle takes all the sport out of it. Some say using a bow with sights takes the sport out of it, but does that mean we shouldn' t have shows the play to the audience that hunts with guns and bows with sights?

Some people like watching shows with long shots.

I' m ready for something new in the hunting tv world, all the shows are about the same at the moment. It would be nice to see someone using the full potential of thier rifle for once. (like a 7mag)

I think most people would know they can' t shoot a deer at 1000 yards if they haven' t practiced it first. If they do think they can do that, then this isn' t thier biggest problem.

Personaly, I would like to see more big game hunting with shotguns. Compounds and blackpowder get most of the tv time. I' ve seen handgun hunts and of course rifle hunts, but I' d say in the last 2 years, I' ve only seen maybe two shows that had anyone using a shotgun on deer. For many people, that is the only legal modern firearm they can use on deer.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

Since you asked for an opinion I would have to say that is not something I would do and call myself a hunter shooting game animals at ranges over 500 yards . I' m sure all your shots will be one shot kills ,but I also realize you can edit anything and show only the good parts of it, so what does that prove . I' m not saying it can' t be done because I shoot targets out to 1000yards ,I' m just saying that is not in my opinion what I would call a hunter , a shooter yes and a good one at that . Good luck with your show .Halcon

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

I have been into a few debates on this topic in a few firearms related forums. Regardless of the ethics involved, the main problem I have with it is one of safety. It violates one of the basic firearms safety rules. Be sure of your target and what is beyond it. Many times they do not connect with their first shot at the 800 to 1,000 yard range due to wind and other factors etc... They use this shot to gain data to make the following shot. I feel you should not even pull the trigger if you are not sure of where the round is going to impact. There may be another hunter near his animal stalking it or maybe a bowhunter nearby. At that range, you don' t know. Shooting on a rifle range at 1000 yards is fun to watch, but it is a controlled environment where there is a backstop and safety officials.

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I think alot of folks look at this from a " Could I make that shot?" perspective. If they cannot then they cannot believe that others can do it in a consistantly repeatable manner. That fact is what separates luck from skill in my mind.

If the person doing the shooting can repeatedly make those shots under those conditions then I see no problem with that type of scenario. However, if the shooter just got plain lucky and does not regularly practice at that distance then I do not think it is a good idea to promote that type of scenario as something that every hunter is capable of participating in.

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First any hunter has to know there limits. Secound I agree with subsonic, 1000yds. is a long way and there is a possibility that another person is in the area. I believe there are enough so called cowboy hunting shows(no offence to real cowboys) we need to have shows that show safety and responsibility. Another thing how do we really know that all the shots were 1 shot kills, the last I new you could edit tv shows.
With that said if you are going to put a show with long range shots on tv you need to explain to the public that it takes alot of practice to make these type of shots.

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If you can hit an eight inch circle 10 out of 10 times at 1000 yards, go for it. I must admit that I am a bit skeptical. On second thought, I am very skeptical.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

I am not in agreement with this show featuring the long range shots mentioned. I will admit it would be interesting to see, but we have enough " Quigley' s" out there without glamourizing the unthinkable by many.
Taking shots at 1000 yards is idiotic in my opinion from a safety factor. And then to suggest that they use the first shot for " ranging" purposes is ludicris. What happens when the animal doesn' t drop? What happened to the spent round? Did it gut shot the animal, or did it lay open the spine or another part of the animal, giving it subject to disease??

500-1000 yard shots should be made at silouettes, not a live animal.

It is also a fact that most unbelievable shots that are made, were not made at the range specified.

Shows like this leave the hunting community wide open to negative opinion by others, and encourage idiots to try these ridiculous shots. I understand that these shots are made by experts in the shooting field, but, where is the sport in it?? Slinging a chunk of lead 1000 yards can be a disaster to anyone in a hunting situation, whether they are an expert or not. It also takes the sportsmanship out of the hunt. If this is what we are going end up idolizing, we might as well give a high powered rifle to anyone and say " Go get' em!" There is no woodsmanship, no hunter' s skill in the stalk, no reason to know the ways and traits of the game being hunted, and no reason to learn it, period. Why would there be?? Anyone, with very little time and no experience, can get within a 1000 yards of anything, no matter how cautious the animal. If this is what the next big thing or craze is in the excitement side of hunting, or what it takes to get someone excited about the hunt, it is time I hang it up. Because sooner than later, someone will regret doing this.

Here is another question, where is the knock down power at these ranges?
I am no rifle expert, but I do know that things slow down greatly at these ranges. And the drop rate could be magnified and completely different from round to round if the proper ammunition is not used. Add this to the human error factor, and then tell me that this is a reasonable shot.

I know that alot of people have made an incredible shot on an animal. But if we were to sit back and think about it, I bet most of them would realize that the shot should not have been made.

If you want to impress me, knock a siluoette down at 1000 yards.

If you want to depress me, screw up on a 1000 yard shot at an animal.

Which likely will happen first??

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

Thanks for all the input, guys. I will try and answer some of the questions asked.

Brokenrack,

I agree, long range or short range the animal doesn’t care. They would just as soon not be shot at all.

Russ otten,

We will explain the work required to be able to hit at longer distances. That’s a part of the show. We will not be exclusively long range by any means.

I used an iron-sighted revolver hunting antelope and whitetails this year. The long range is just something that happens once n a while although we practice it a lot.

Kodiakhuntmaster,

Thanks for the input. Sorry but we don’t have any shotgun hunts on film but we do have some handgunning (my favorite way to hunt).

Subsonic,

Actually we do know exactly what is around the animal. The reality of such shot is the area has to be open to be able to see very far. Most situations are what we call cross-canyon shots with a safe backstop in the event something goes wrong.

All distance are measured with laser rangefinders so I am either a bald face liar or things happened as reported. No mistaken or guessed at ranges.

I have a standing bet: For a proper amount we will recreate any shot we have on video. Hit or miss, winner takes all.

I never said we used any “ranging shots”. We fully expect to make the first shot the only shot.

If we had to edit out much footage because of missed shots we would not be able to get enough footage to make a show. It just plain costs us real money to blow an opportunity by taking shots we cannot make regularly. We don’t ever fire what I refer to as “Hopers” (I hope I make that shot).

Keep up the response. It helps us decide what we are going to do.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

Dang, no shotguns? I' ll bet you don' t even have any traditional archers either... Oh well, the handgun hunts are neat anyway[&:].

I know you guys that make these shows practice alot. So I see no problem with the occasional long shot. That' s what specialized calibers like 7mag and such were made for.

Good luck with the new show.

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kodiakhuntmaster,

We do have some traditional archery. Long bow and cedar arrows even.

John

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

i will try and watch it. i see nothing wrong with long shots. just as long as u bring the animal down. if ur gun will bring em down at the range you are going to attempt a shot there is nothing wrong with it.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

John B- I have not spoke with you about this topic before. I never said " you" used ranging shots or " you" guessed at ranges. You asked for feedback and I gave it to you based on my encounters with people that take extreme shots. I still don' t see how you can be " exactly" sure what is around an animal from 800 yards. It is my opinion, and I am sticking to it that 800 yard shots are best left on the rifle range.

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subsonic,

Sorry about the confusion. Some of my remarks listed after your name were not directed at you. Just some of the things others had said and I was answering. After looking at my post I can see how I did not make that clear. Sorry again for my screwup. Thanks for the input.

John

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

John B- No blood no foul :-) What Traditional Archery stuff do you guys have planned?

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

I have a question.If your show has 10 single shot kills ,between 500 and 800 yards,how many other wounded deer were there that didnt make the final cut?Did you edit the bad shots?or should I believe that every " single" shot was fatal?

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

John B, out of curiosity, how many times, with a cold barrel can you hit a kill zone in a row at 800++ yards? A number of years ago our 155 outfit would lob a round out about 15 miles, then adjust a time or two and then fire battery effect. Not real neat, but very effective, but not exactly ethical in my opinion for hunting.

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As others have said, I am ok with long range shots as long as you are not wounding 5 animals to get 10 good shots on film.

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It doesn' t matter what type of " disclaimer" , for lack of better words, you would use in explaining the effort and training that goes into shooting at these ranges. This type of shooting requires a great deal of skill. But this show will just encourage others to try it, and that is the last thing we need in the hunting community is a bunch of people trying these type of shots.

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I don' t see much point in a show like that, doesn' t seem like something I' d bother watching. I know full well there' s plenty of people who can make those shots with confidence, but how fun would a show be with animals tipping over at 600yds? About as much fun as televising a sillouette shoot. The fun of TV shows for most folks is seeing the hunter get close, stalk, etc.
Nothing wrong with a skilled shot taking game at long ranges, but I just don' t see folks tuning in to watch it. There' s enough poor quality hunting shows to watch as it is.

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There are a lot of guys that do just this every year in PA.. They sit on logging and forestry roads. Glass the mtn. across from them and then take deer at ranges from 500yds. to over 1000yds. These guys are very ethical hunters and dont take shots they feel they cant make.I have hunted with one of them and took a doe at a little over 700yds.First shot hit just to the right of her second took her in the neck dead on the spot. Not trying to push another site but there is a thread in huntingpa about this. Go to general hunting and check back probably 60 days. There are pictures there as well.

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

Thanks for all the great input guys. I made this post over on the Big Game forum and I will answer questions on that forum so it is a littlw more manageable for me. Some of the guys have called BS so I will have to do some explaining.

I really enjoy this stuff.

Thanks again.

Show will start April 7 2003 on The Sportsman Channel. www.thesportsmanchannel.com

Information on how to get the Sportsman Channel is on the web site. 100% hunting and fishing.

John

RE: Long Range Shooting at Game Animals
 

John B:
I hope you are still checkin this post as im a new long range Hunter & hopin to make it the only way i hunt. My Dad & his best friend bought two long range guns back in the early 80' s & they have from Pa to Mt.I have always wanted to be a part of the long range hunting but until this past season I have not been able to take the time off to hunt both weeks of Pa' s buck season & they always long range the 2nd week. This year I finally got the chance!! & man i fell in love!!!!! I will be calling my local cable company as soon as they open today to request your show. I have had dreams of makin a show like this devoted to long ranging but im just glad that someone is going to do it. I have devoted alot of time since December getting as much knowledge about the sport as i can pack in my brain & the more i read the more interesting it gets.The gun i use is a custom built bench gun in 30-378 weatherby mag topped with unertl 15x scope,we scan for deer with a pair of tank glasses then dial in on em with a pair of bushnell spacemasters for a better look. Id really be interested to find out what gear your using. I have pictures i can send you if you' d like just email me at [email protected] i cant figure out how to get them on here. Id love to talk more with you about this subject & im definately looking forward to your television show
Thank You
Mike